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Old 09-01-2009, 09:17 PM   #31
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Service Load Calcs and Install


Your disposal can probably grind up whole cows at a time.

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Old 09-01-2009, 09:20 PM   #32
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You guys are right about me tripping the main breaker it will NOT ever happen, and if it does I turn off a few things and go and rest the breaker. NOT a big deal.

But I paid a good price for this house and it is required to be up to code. If NEC says it should have 250amp service then it should. While I'm in a position to make things happen and hold those responsible for their decisions and actions.

And if by chance when I go to sell the house and some sharp inspector figures the panel is under serviced and requires me to upgrade the service all the way to the street (at $3k like others have indicated) then I'm a fool for not taking action when I could.
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Old 09-01-2009, 09:24 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by sstinman View Post
You guys are right about me tripping the main breaker it will NOT ever happen, and if it does I turn off a few things and go and rest the breaker. NOT a big deal.

But I paid a good price for this house and it is required to be up to code. If NEC says it should have 250amp service then it should. While I'm in a position to make things happen and hold those responsible for their decisions and actions.

And if by chance when I go to sell the house and some sharp inspector figures the panel is under serviced and requires me to upgrade the service all the way to the street (at $3k like others have indicated) then I'm a fool for not taking action when I could.
Look, hire another contractor to do a load calculation. problem solved.
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Old 09-01-2009, 09:30 PM   #34
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Service Load Calcs and Install


Or use your wattmeter as an ammeter to see how much headroom you've got when a lot of stuff is switched on.

235 to 217 is 226 4%. That's pretty close.

Last edited by Yoyizit; 09-01-2009 at 09:32 PM.
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Old 09-01-2009, 09:44 PM   #35
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Speaking of meters I have a multimeter, can I buy ammeter leads for it and take readings directly, like a clamp-meter would?? if so, can you point me to a part number?

Also my post at the bottom of page two comes to the conclusion I will hire a pro to do the calculations. But I think I did myself a favor by getting all the input data readily available for him to use.
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Old 09-01-2009, 09:51 PM   #36
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Service Load Calcs and Install


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Originally Posted by chris75 View Post
In my stupd opinion, I'd be impressed for a family to trip a 100 amp breaker. just my stupid opinion of course.
That's where the difference between theory and reality comes into play.
I once had an argument with a customer who wasn't happy with the 200 Amp. Main he had. (That's the max the POCO, Con Ed gives for Residential) Five years after the job was done, and the Main Breaker didn't trip once. And it won't trip! Let's just do some (ridiculous) Math, to prove a point. 235 Amps. @ 220V.=51.7 KVA.; @ 22c./KWH that would come to $11,374.00/hour. Multiplied by 6 (hours of peak use)= 68,244.00! That's my point! No matter whatDon't Drink and Drive!!!
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Old 09-01-2009, 10:01 PM   #37
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I'm sure the house you bought has already had an Electrical Inspector come to inspect it at the time it was built. If it was already specced out in the plans that there will be all the appliances that you mentioned and the Electrical Inspector passed it that way and a possible accurate load calculation done at that time(which inspectors where I am from do require before final inspection.) then good luck fighting for that in court. You will sit for years playing the blame game going around and around. Also, at the time it was built load calculations could have been different then what it is now. Go to your building department and ask if they have records of the inspections, although I highly doubt they would keep that good of a record.
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Old 09-01-2009, 10:07 PM   #38
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[quote=spark plug;322659] Math, to prove a point. 235 Amps. @ 220V.=51.7 KVA.; @ 22c./KWH that would come to $11,374.00/hour. Multiplied by 6 (hours of peak use)= 68,244.00!


Shouldn't the math work out to $11.374/hour ???

Last months bill was over $500 (at a rate of $0.0893/kWh) used something like 4 Mega Watts for the month, trying to conserve energy as well. That is how I found the duct work was not done properly and causing the A/C system to run hard and not cool the house effectively. The joy of home ownership.
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Old 09-01-2009, 10:14 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by sstinman View Post
Last months bill was over $500 (at a rate of $0.0893/kWh) used something like 4 Mega Watts for the month,
http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/consumpt...on_tables.html
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Old 09-01-2009, 10:18 PM   #40
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Well I'm good at something, better than 95% of all Americans at 28 Mega Watts if I continue last month's usage through the next 11 months. A guy needs to set goals in life.
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Old 09-02-2009, 12:17 PM   #41
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[quote=sstinman;322668]
Quote:
Originally Posted by spark plug View Post
Math, to prove a point. 235 Amps. @ 220V.=51.7 KVA.; @ 22c./KWH that would come to $11,374.00/hour. Multiplied by 6 (hours of peak use)= 68,244.00!


Shouldn't the math work out to $11.374/hour ???

Last months bill was over $500 (at a rate of $0.0893/kWh) used something like 4 Mega Watts for the month, trying to conserve energy as well. That is how I found the duct work was not done properly and causing the A/C system to run hard and not cool the house effectively. The joy of home ownership.
Yes, SSTinman. My figures were wrooong! I mistook a Decimal for a Comma! $11,374 a/o 11.374; That's the disadvantage of working? in semi-darkness!
But according to my calculations? your usage for the month was much higher than 4 Megawatts. It should be 5599.1041 MW. Unless your rate per KWH is not the net rate. The way I figure my bill (regardless of how the utility figures it and additional charges they slap on) is; Divide the TOTAL bill by usage! The net rate in my hometown comes to .238 or 23.8c/kwh;(No matter what)Don't Drink and Drive!!!

Last edited by spark plug; 09-02-2009 at 12:19 PM. Reason: duplication of words
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Old 09-02-2009, 07:30 PM   #42
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Got a fantastic deal on a clamp meter, $45 with shipping and taxes. I bought the Ideal 61-768 (last year's version at 600amps). The guy told me I got the last one in inventory (from San Diego). The unit retails for $213 but now its discontinued as the new model is rated for 660amps.

http://www.idealindustries.com/produ...lamp_meter.jsp



Get ready for some actual data to back up the nameplate ratings.
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Old 09-02-2009, 08:46 PM   #43
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Watch out for arc flash.
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Old 09-03-2009, 04:35 PM   #44
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Guess what I found, the electrical company has my meter mixed-up with my neighbor's meter. So I was getting his bills and he was receiving mine.
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Old 09-03-2009, 04:46 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sstinman View Post
Guess what I found, the electrical company has my meter mixed-up with my neighbor's meter. So I was getting his bills and he was receiving mine.
Is your neighbor Al Gore?
http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?se......&id=5072659

Seems like you're owed money, plus interest.
The formula for the Present Value of an Annuity [your monthly bill is an annuity for PoCo] will tell you how much. Or you can use a spreadsheet to calc. it, because the amount changes each month.
7% interest per year is 100{1-[(1.07)^(1/12)]} = 0.565% interest each month.

This beat's all.


Last edited by Yoyizit; 09-03-2009 at 08:38 PM.
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