Running New(up To Code) Ground Wire & Protection. - Electrical - DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum


Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > Home Improvement > Electrical

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-27-2010, 01:09 PM   #1
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 3
Rewards Points: 10
Default

Running new(up to code) ground wire & protection.


I recently replaced my old FPE breaker with a newer updated one simply due to the additional circuits I would be adding to the house (namely solar panels), under the instruction of a friend of a friend who's an electrician, he told me because I replaced it (and it's an obvious replacement) the ground needs to be brought up to code unless I want it to be flagged by the inspector.

Currently it's a 100amp panel, and the current ground consisted of a #6 wire being strung up to and attached to a cold water pipe that's somewhat close to the panel (maybe 10 feet), I was told that I need to connect a ground within 5 feet of where the cold water enters the ground, as well as connect to the house size of the gas lines as well (I don't get it, but whatever), and the wire needs to be at least #4 which I have plenty of (also need to hammer ground rods for a 2nd.. but whatever for now).

Since he left for vacation I can't get ahold of him however I'm wondering what sort of protection needs to be done for the ground wire as the cold is on the other side of the garage. Do I need to run the single wire in conduit? or can I drill through the studs (ala romex) and run the wire through there (even though it's not romex #4) or can the wire be exposed (stapled) because it's not carrying a load?

Thanks.

Advertisement

MikeSF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2010, 02:28 PM   #2
Totally screwed together
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Cypress, SoCal
Posts: 325
Rewards Points: 250
Default

Running new(up to code) ground wire & protection.


They sell ground wire at the big boxes already wrapped in flexible aluminumn sheathing, in 25' and 100' lenths. You need to have a continuous connection (no breaks) between your panel and your ground.

Your cold water pip isn't a true ground, but keep that connection as it does need to be bonded to. A pair of ground rods will be your true ground.

Advertisement

xxPaulCPxx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2010, 03:48 PM   #3
Master Electrician
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Indiana
Posts: 2,976
Rewards Points: 2,208
Default

Running new(up to code) ground wire & protection.


You do not need sheathing on the ground wire to the water line. The water pipe ground is far superior to any two grounding rods- but you should do both.
brric is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2010, 05:08 PM   #4
Licensed Electrical Cont.
 
Speedy Petey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: NY State
Posts: 6,899
Rewards Points: 2,152
Default

Running new(up to code) ground wire & protection.


Quote:
Originally Posted by brric View Post
You do not need sheathing on the ground wire to the water line. The water pipe ground is far superior to any two grounding rods- but you should do both.
Agree.
Speedy Petey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2010, 05:31 PM   #5
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 3
Rewards Points: 10
Default

Running new(up to code) ground wire & protection.


Thanks for the reply.

So just to make things clear, ground only needs to be stapled to the rafters to get to the water pipe? (unfinished basement area).

And yeah, I know two ground rods are additional, and thanks to San Francisco code is a necessity.
MikeSF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2010, 05:44 PM   #6
Master Electrician
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Indiana
Posts: 2,976
Rewards Points: 2,208
Default

Running new(up to code) ground wire & protection.


There are no rafters in a basement. You would be better off drilling the floor joists to accomodate the wire.
brric is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2010, 06:38 PM   #7
nap
You talking to me?
 
nap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: sw mi
Posts: 5,407
Rewards Points: 2,000
Default

Running new(up to code) ground wire & protection.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeSF View Post

And yeah, I know two ground rods are additional, and thanks to San Francisco code is a necessity.
If the water pipe is your only grounding electrode, any place the follows the NEC requires at least 1 rod in addition to the water pipe BUT in addition to the rod itself, the rod must show less than 25 ohms resistance to Earth or a 2nd rod must be installed so unless a person wants to go to the trouble of a resistance test, everybody just drives 2 rods in addition to the water pipe.

so, most of the country would require 2 rods, not just San Francisco.
nap is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2010, 08:56 PM   #8
Totally screwed together
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Cypress, SoCal
Posts: 325
Rewards Points: 250
Default

Running new(up to code) ground wire & protection.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeSF View Post
So just to make things clear, ground only needs to be stapled to the rafters to get to the water pipe? (unfinished basement area).
That is correct. Though carrying no current, they should still be treated like romex in that you protect the cable and keep it from been worn away by abrasion. That's less a concern with a single strand of thick copper, but is a concern with thinner stranded type that is much easier to handle and pull.
xxPaulCPxx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2010, 09:23 PM   #9
Licensed electrician
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Maryland
Posts: 8,004
Rewards Points: 2,806
Default

Running new(up to code) ground wire & protection.


Quote:
Originally Posted by xxPaulCPxx View Post
Your cold water pipe isn't a true ground, but keep that connection as it does need to be bonded to. A pair of ground rods will be your true ground.
The water line ground is the primary. The rods would be the supplemental ground.
__________________
Answers based on the National Electrical Code. Local amendments may apply. Check with your local building officials.
Jim Port is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-28-2010, 11:44 AM   #10
Totally screwed together
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Cypress, SoCal
Posts: 325
Rewards Points: 250
Default

Running new(up to code) ground wire & protection.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Port View Post
The water line ground is the primary. The rods would be the supplemental ground.
It is primary as it is a better ground, with more surface area and longer contact surface than a 5/8" rod... until your water company comes out and replaces it with plastic pipe.

Oops! Hope no one gets the impression that it's OK to just ground off your water pipe. Right about now is when alot of the post WWII baby boom housing is getting their copper pipe replaced due to corrosion from soil contact under the slabs.
xxPaulCPxx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-28-2010, 12:18 PM   #11
Master Electrician
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Indiana
Posts: 2,976
Rewards Points: 2,208
Default

Running new(up to code) ground wire & protection.


Why don't you explain to us how effective you think a pair of rods is for grounding?
brric is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-28-2010, 12:51 PM   #12
Totally screwed together
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Cypress, SoCal
Posts: 325
Rewards Points: 250
Default

Running new(up to code) ground wire & protection.


Compared to what?

A disconnected cold water pipe? A UFER? 3 or more Ground rods? Ground rods driven at a 45 degree angle? Ground plate?
xxPaulCPxx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-28-2010, 01:24 PM   #13
Master Electrician
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Indiana
Posts: 2,976
Rewards Points: 2,208
Default

Running new(up to code) ground wire & protection.


Two standard 5/8" x 8' galvanized ground rods.
brric is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-28-2010, 02:03 PM   #14
Totally screwed together
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Cypress, SoCal
Posts: 325
Rewards Points: 250
Default

Running new(up to code) ground wire & protection.


Why don't you explain to us how effective you think a pair of rods is for grounding?


Compared to what?

Two standard 5/8" x 8' galvanized ground rods.


You want me to compare what I suggested to what I suggested?
xxPaulCPxx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-28-2010, 02:23 PM   #15
Licensed electrician
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Maryland
Posts: 8,004
Rewards Points: 2,806
Default

Running new(up to code) ground wire & protection.


Going backwards in the posts, this might be why Brric is asking about the ground rods and their function.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xxPaulCPxx View Post
Your cold water pip isn't a true ground, but keep that connection as it does need to be bonded to. A pair of ground rods will be your true ground.

Advertisement

__________________
Answers based on the National Electrical Code. Local amendments may apply. Check with your local building officials.
Jim Port is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
running wire underground for outdoor outlet ponch37300 Electrical 11 06-26-2009 10:41 AM
hooking up dryer....bronx ny code SURFBUG Appliances 6 10-14-2008 10:41 PM
Grounding conduit instead of using a ground wire? stringtheories Electrical 10 08-02-2008 01:42 PM
Hot Tub Install--Grounding Rod Question statgeek_rob Electrical 16 09-15-2007 03:59 AM




Top of Page | View New Posts