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Old 12-17-2012, 05:02 PM   #1
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Routing coax through small section of cold air return


Okay. I'll try to explain this as clear as possible.

My cold air return is basically a joist cavity for half the run and then the other half is duct work tied in to the joist cavity. The cold air return vent is on the first floor and that ties into the joist cavity in the basement.


I would like to know if its possible to make a small hole in one of the joist to run coax cable up about 18 inches to the first floor?


I read somewhere that as long as the cable is not running along the entire length of the return it is okay. It must also be perpendicular and plenum rated.

Any truth to this?

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Old 12-17-2012, 05:09 PM   #2
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Routing coax through small section of cold air return


Quote:
Originally Posted by gta View Post

I read somewhere that as long as the cable is not running along the entire length of the return it is okay. It must also be perpendicular and plenum rated.

Any truth to this?

It must be perpendicular and plenum rated


Correct.

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Old 12-17-2012, 05:25 PM   #3
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Routing coax through small section of cold air return


Is this commonly done in residential houses?
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Old 12-17-2012, 06:12 PM   #4
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Routing coax through small section of cold air return


Quote:
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It must be perpendicular and plenum rated

Correct.
It is not a plenum. NM-B is run perpendicular all the time and it is not plenum rated.
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Old 12-17-2012, 06:16 PM   #5
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Routing coax through small section of cold air return


So you can run perpendicular if its a joist cavity and not metal ductwork right?


Also, what would be considered a plenum in a residential house?
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Old 12-17-2012, 06:26 PM   #6
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Routing coax through small section of cold air return


It can be run perpendicular to the plenum without it being plenum rated. If you run the length of the plenun than it has to be plenum rated.
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Old 12-17-2012, 06:29 PM   #7
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Routing coax through small section of cold air return


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So you can run perpendicular if its a joist cavity and not metal ductwork right?


Also, what would be considered a plenum in a residential house?
The top of the furnace where the duct work branches from is the plenum.
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Old 12-17-2012, 06:40 PM   #8
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Routing coax through small section of cold air return


I just noticed you are talking about COAX!

Do what you want and have fun!


Thanks for the clarification on the plenum rating guys!
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Old 12-18-2012, 12:14 AM   #9
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Routing coax through small section of cold air return


So what brric said about NM-B wire can also apply to coax right?

I just want to be absolutely sure.

Thanks.
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Old 12-18-2012, 01:09 AM   #10
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Routing coax through small section of cold air return


Quote:
Originally Posted by gta View Post
So what brric said about NM-B wire can also apply to coax right?

I just want to be absolutely sure.

Thanks.
Yes,no concerns with coax/ video cable.
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Old 12-18-2012, 05:54 AM   #11
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Routing coax through small section of cold air return


There ARE codes in the NEC for CATV installation. It is not a "free-for-all" as some seem to think.
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Last edited by k_buz; 12-18-2012 at 06:04 AM.
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Old 12-18-2012, 06:36 AM   #12
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Routing coax through small section of cold air return


820.113 Installation of Coaxial Cables. Installation of co-
axial cables shall comply with 820.113(A) through (K).
Installation of raceways shall comply with 820.110.

(A) Listing. Coaxial cables installed in buildings shall be
listed.
Exception: Coaxial cables that comply with 820.48 shall not
be required to be listed.
(B) Fabricated Ducts Used for Environmental Air. The
following cables shall be permitted in ducts as described in
300.22(B) if they are directly associated with the air distri-
bution system:
(1) Up to 1.22 m (4 ft) of Type CATVP cable (the P means plenum listed)

(C) Other Spaces Used For Environmental Air (Plenums).
The following cables shall be permitted in other spaces used
for environmental air as described in 300.22(C):
(1) Type CATVP cable
(2) Type CATVP cable installed in plenum communica-
tions raceway
(3) Type CATVP cable supported by open metallic cable
trays or cable tray systems
(4) Types CATVP, CATVR, CATV, and CATVX cables in-
stalled in raceways that are installed in compliance
with 300.22(C)

300.22 Wiring in Ducts Not Used for Air Handling,
Fabricated Ducts for Environmental Air, and Other
Spaces for Environmental Air (Plenums).

C) Other Spaces Used for Environmental Air (Ple-
nums). This section shall apply to spaces not specifically
fabricated for environmental air-handling purposes but used
for air-handling purposes as a plenum. This section shall
not apply to habitable rooms or areas of buildings, the
prime purpose of which is not air handling.


Exception: This section shall not apply to the joist or stud
spaces of dwelling units where the wiring passes through
such spaces perpendicular to the long dimension of such
spaces.



The way I am reading this, the perpendicular exception also applies to CATV cable.

Thanks for the homework!

I am taking the NEC class next semester, and am trying to get a head start.
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Old 12-18-2012, 06:55 AM   #13
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Routing coax through small section of cold air return


Just found this, it sure helps!


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#2 - If you follow my advice and something bad happens see # 1
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Last edited by TTW; 12-18-2012 at 06:58 AM. Reason: resized
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Old 12-18-2012, 09:53 AM   #14
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Routing coax through small section of cold air return


Quote:
Originally Posted by TTW View Post
820.113 Installation of Coaxial Cables. Installation of co-
axial cables shall comply with 820.113(A) through (K).
Installation of raceways shall comply with 820.110.

(A) Listing. Coaxial cables installed in buildings shall be
listed.
Exception: Coaxial cables that comply with 820.48 shall not
be required to be listed.
(B) Fabricated Ducts Used for Environmental Air. The
following cables shall be permitted in ducts as described in
300.22(B) if they are directly associated with the air distri-
bution system:
(1) Up to 1.22 m (4 ft) of Type CATVP cable (the P means plenum listed)

(C) Other Spaces Used For Environmental Air (Plenums).
The following cables shall be permitted in other spaces used
for environmental air as described in 300.22(C):
(1) Type CATVP cable
(2) Type CATVP cable installed in plenum communica-
tions raceway
(3) Type CATVP cable supported by open metallic cable
trays or cable tray systems
(4) Types CATVP, CATVR, CATV, and CATVX cables in-
stalled in raceways that are installed in compliance
with 300.22(C)

300.22 Wiring in Ducts Not Used for Air Handling,
Fabricated Ducts for Environmental Air, and Other
Spaces for Environmental Air (Plenums).

C) Other Spaces Used for Environmental Air (Ple-
nums). This section shall apply to spaces not specifically
fabricated for environmental air-handling purposes but used
for air-handling purposes as a plenum. This section shall
not apply to habitable rooms or areas of buildings, the
prime purpose of which is not air handling.

Exception: This section shall not apply to the joist or stud
spaces of dwelling units where the wiring passes through
such spaces perpendicular to the long dimension of such
spaces.

The way I am reading this, the perpendicular exception also applies to CATV cable.
So it seems it is a "free for all" in this situation.
How about that!
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Old 12-18-2012, 10:00 AM   #15
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Routing coax through small section of cold air return


It is not a free for all. The cable needs to follow the rules shown above.

Sublime, many here try to only give answers that follow the code. When you give answers it would help greatly if you would give correct answers also not just ones you agree with.

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