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Is it right that an owner must be licensed to perform work

9K views 45 replies 18 participants last post by  Piedmont 
#1 ·
From the way this sounds, I can't perform any electrical work on my house. Is this correct, or is there something written here that I am not understanding?

http://www.sioux-city.org/custom/co...ioux-city.org/codemaster/Title_20/08/130.html

Section 20.08.130 Applicability to existing buildings.

1. All new work performed in existing buildings must comply with all provisions of this code.
2. All electrical work performed on existing buildings must be performed by a licensed electrical contractor utilizing licensed master, journeymen and apprentice electricians, except as detailed in Section 20.08.060.
3. Change of service. When an existing electrical service is increased, changed or moved, then the entire system which is supplied by that service must be brought into compliance with the current code.
4. Conversion. The electrical system of any building being converted from an existing occupancy to a new occupancy must comply with the provisions of this code governing the new occupancy.
5. Existing buildings to which new additions are being attached must also be updated and brought into compliance with this code when they are found to be unsafe due to any of the following:
a. Existing wiring has been improperly installed or maintained. The existing wiring has been added to, removed, or tampered with in a manner which creates an unsafe condition.
b. The existing electrical service is overloaded; overfused; has been tampered with; or is, in any other manner, unsafe.
c. The existing light fixtures, switches or receptacles do not meet the following H.U.D. Section 8 Minimum Housing Quality Standards for illumination and appliance use.
(1) Light fixtures - All rooms (except closets) must have at least one permanently installed ceiling or wall light fixture. However, a switched wall receptacle may be accepted in lieu of a permanent ceiling or wall light.
(2) Receptacle - All rooms (except closets) must have at least one duplex receptacle.
(3) All stairways are adequately illuminated. Stair lights shall be controlled so it will not be necessary to use stairs in the dark.
(4) All fixtures and receptacles are in sound condition and safe for continued use.
6. Existing buildings - maintenance and repair.
a. All electrical work in existing buildings must be performed by a licensed electrical contractor utilizing licensed master, journeymen, and apprentice electricians.
b. All maintenance and repair work must comply with all provisions of the current code. (Ord. 2000-9110; 97/U-6146)
 
#11 ·
i call i racket by municipalities and licensed professionals.

i do support having inspections but why can't an inspector inspect work done by anyone - if it is done up to code, why does it matter who did it ?

I agree to a point. If that someone is charging then he should be licensed. If it's the HO on his own house and he can pass inspection then I'm all for it.
 
#13 ·
Section 20.08.060 Electrical inspector - Office and duty.

There is created within the inspection services division the position of electrical inspector. A person must possess either a current Sioux City master electrician's license or Sioux City journeyman electrician's license prior to applying for the position of electrical inspector.
It shall be the duty of the electrical inspector to administer and enforce provisions of this code, subject to the supervision and control of the manager. The inspection services division shall keep complete records of all permits issued, inspections made, and other official work performed. (Ord. 97/U-6146)
 
#17 ·
it is really sad when we all have to suffer consequential regulation after someone does something stupid like use hair blower in the shower and aggressive mortgage lending.

one thing that particularly annoys me is that i cannot have track lights within 3 ft of the bath tub in the bathroom to protect a potential moron from tampering with it while showering on the edge of the tub. after all, someone like that should be removed from the gene pool.

why do we all have to suffer for the stupidity of the few ?
 
#23 ·
I believe over here it is more or less the same but permits are needed for major work within the house [at least for outside]

I suppose it'll be too late for an inspector to inspect a code job if the house burned down [prolly burning someone else's house as well].

for that reason sounds like they want the lis. skills for the code job in the first place.


Not fair to the family and/or family pets if some dude thought he knew it all and burned down the house.
 
#24 ·
I don't understand the logic of limiting rental, commercial and industrial owners to a number of fixture changes per year in Section 20.08.060. Do they lose the knowledge the more they install?

I'm all for licensed contractors doing electrical work for pay, but this document is a little extreme. At best, it was written out of ignorance. At worst, there was some misplaced influence.
 
#25 ·
I have seen many bad wiring installations done by cost cutting home builders and by cost cutting home owners. In both cases the temptation to save money overruled the importance of a safe or usable installation. The codes are in place to protect the next person who buys or rents a house or office space. Go to a 3rd world country where there is no code enforcement and look at the wiring with masking tape splices or buildings that have collapsed because someone left out the rebar.

Human nature is not conducive to consistent good construction practices and more than it is conducive to good banking or investment practices when regulations are removed.

A homeowner does not need to be a licensed contractor to do many construction tasks on their own, whether it is pouring concrete for a patio or replacing doors or windows or repairing plumbing. Installing a gas line or a 220V circuit for a hot tub though is required to be done by a licensed professional as a matter of public safety. I for one would be more than a little upset to have a friend or family member blown up or electrocuted because someone decided to save a few hundred dollars.

These days with the current economy it is not hard to find licensed plumbers and electricians charging $55 an hour so the total cost of a project is not really increased significantly by hiring a professional.
 
#27 ·
In Sioux City (place where op asked question) they want to pass a law so that ANY electrical, plumbing, HVAC, etc. HAS to be done BY a licensed professional. You wouldn't be able to get a permit. Its just about supporting the union, they have no other explanation as to why it would be better to have licensed people to do it instead. They say it will help protect people, after people complained about how it would get inspected anyways, they say it will protect the person doing it.
 
#26 ·
that is what inspection is for. why not allow anyone to pull a license and do the work, which will be inspected and failed if it does not pass muster? why does it matter who does the work? IRS does not care who did your tax return (you or H&R Block) as long as it is done right.

i could not be more convinced that the way it is is because of a racket scheme between the muni govts and licensed pro trade associations or unions or whatever.
 
#30 ·
i think this issue needs to be addressed on a federal level, i.e. some legislation passed to make EVERY municipality have to adhere to some federal law defining what people can and cannot do with their houses. in other words, it would be nice if this issue was not let at the discretion of local governments but enforced on the federal level. i know a lot of people are for local/state rights as opposed to federal but i think this would work very nicely.

do i see it coming: NO. :(
 
#32 ·
The Kendell Jackson company built a winery and vineyard in Monterey county and cut down over 400 century oaks preferring to pay the fine so they could have straight uninterrupted rows. After that the law was changed so that the arborist who performed any such illegal work in the future would lose their license which is a much more effective deterrent. I can see the same with the homeowner doing a AC repair and not caring about using black market refrigerant smuggled in from Mexico while a licensed contractor would not jeopardize their business and livelihood by breaking the law.

When I see the questions posted on forums or overhear people asking for guidance from the guy working the aisle at Home Depot or Ace I know that the person does not have a clue and is not going to do the job correctly. I have seen codes that were rigorously enforced by the inspectors and had money wasted because I had to have work redone by builders that screwed up but like to blame the darn inspector rather than themselves for trying to cut corners. I lost my 8 year old home in the 1989 Loma Prieta earthquake because the builder only built to code minimums and none of the key framing members were properly braced - something the person I bought the house from either did not know or failed to disclose.
 
#34 ·
When I see the questions posted on forums or overhear people asking for guidance from the guy working the aisle at Home Depot or Ace I know that the person does not have a clue and is not going to do the job correctly. I have seen codes that were rigorously enforced by the inspectors and had money wasted because I had to have work redone by builders that screwed up but like to blame the darn inspector rather than themselves for trying to cut corners. I lost my 8 year old home in the 1989 Loma Prieta earthquake because the builder only built to code minimums and none of the key framing members were properly braced - something the person I bought the house from either did not know or failed to disclose.
I agree that this is very likely true in many cases, but some people out there that ask a lot of questions do take the time to make sure what they are doing is correct, safe and legal. Not trying to put this on you by any means, but it bothers me when some people assume that the "naive DIY'er" is just gonna do what they need to do to make it work and have little regard for safety or code. It isn't that way with every DIY.

I ask many many questions of many people, but I verify that information with reliable sources, my favorite source, my copy of the 2005 NEC code, If it's wrong were all in trouble. :) There are also several very trustworthy reliable people here on this board that give excellent, up to code safe information.

Jamie
 
#33 ·
I lived in a city that had very restrictive codes about home owners doing their own work.

The required a plumber, electrician, and a few other odds and ends. Bottom line was that the home owner couldn't do anything.

I build a very large shop on the property and didn't have any electrical or plumbing. It passed inspection. Then after everyone left I uncovered the plumbing and electrical holes to the conduit I had put in the concrete and wired and plumbed the whole place. It was quite a few years back. From what I understand they changed the code so that HO's (not the kind walking the streets) can do their own work as long as it's code.
 
#35 ·
OK. So let's say my town makes it illegal for me to do any electrical, plumbing, or any other "major" repairs or changes to my home without employing a licensed professional and having the proper inspections done.
Who is going to stop me from walking into my local Home Depot store, purchasing a 250 ft roll of Romex cable, some boxes, receptacles, etc and going about the job.
Is someone going to photograph me buying the stuff at HD, then follow me home and spring upon me once I get inside?

I suppose legislation could be proposed (but it would never pass) to restrict the purchase of certain items (electrical cable, boxes, and more than say 5 receptacles at a time) from anywhere? A licensed contractor would of course have to show his or her license when making the purchase.
Legislation like this would not have a chance in Hell to pass around here. The home improvement stores would fight it tooth and nail.
 
#36 ·
OK. So let's say my town makes it illegal for me to do any electrical, plumbing, or any other "major" repairs or changes to my home without employing a licensed professional and having the proper inspections done.
Who is going to stop me from walking into my local Home Depot store, purchasing a 250 ft roll of Romex cable, some boxes, receptacles, etc and going about the job.
This would never pass since certainly there could be the same argument for those fixing their own cars (safety issues of course!), appliances etc. It would change the entire landscape of DIY !!!

Every retailer of DIY products (AutoZone, PepBoys, HomeD, Lowes) would be on the side of the homeowner/driver etc. The towns and states would not want that loss of taxes.

I do disagree about the inspections done though. I'm not saying that you shouldn't be able to do your own work, I just think you might need to have it inspected for your own liability. Major work such as additions or significant rewiring for instance. I wired my own addition (my town allows you to do so with permits and electric inspections), the inspector passed it with flying colors.
 
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