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Old 08-10-2009, 05:11 PM   #1
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Replacing 8-Conductor GFCI


The outlets in my garage are all daisy-chained off a single GFCI outlet adjacent to my electrical panel. I just ordered a small refrigerator for the garage, so I decided to remove that GFCI outlet and replace it with a standard duplex outlet. When I removed the cover plate and pulled out the GFCI device from the box, I noticed that it is wired with 8 conductors (plus ground wire). The Cooper GFCI device has connectors for 4 line wires (2 hot + 2 neutral) and 4 load wires (2 hot + 2 neutral) -- all 8 connectors are present.

Can someone tell me why this GFCI device is wired in this way instead of the usual single black/single white conductors for line and load? Also, given this wiring configuration, is it possible to replace the GFCI with a non-GFCI outlet?

Thanks,
Ari

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Old 08-10-2009, 05:43 PM   #2
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Replacing 8-Conductor GFCI


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Originally Posted by SalomonDIY View Post
The outlets in my garage are all daisy-chained off a single GFCI outlet adjacent to my electrical panel. I just ordered a small refrigerator for the garage, so I decided to remove that GFCI outlet and replace it with a standard duplex outlet. When I removed the cover plate and pulled out the GFCI device from the box, I noticed that it is wired with 8 conductors (plus ground wire). The Cooper GFCI device has connectors for 4 line wires (2 hot + 2 neutral) and 4 load wires (2 hot + 2 neutral) -- all 8 connectors are present.

Can someone tell me why this GFCI device is wired in this way instead of the usual single black/single white conductors for line and load? Also, given this wiring configuration, is it possible to replace the GFCI with a non-GFCI outlet?

Thanks,
Ari
I've never seen all 8 locations in use at once before, but I can see how that would work. Not sure why someone would choose to do it that way, though. The line side is daisy chained with other devices (i.e. it has an incoming pair and an outgoing pair feeding other devices downstream, but not GFCI protected) and the load side feeds two sets of downstream devices, as if this receptacle were in the middle of a chain. You could replace it with a normal receptacle, but would probably have to pigtail the connections unless you can find a plain receptacle that accepts 2 conductors on each terminal. However, note that you have at least two downstream devices (maybe many more) that were being protected by this GFCI. You'll have to find them and replace them with GFCI devices.

Why remove this GFCI at all? Properly functioning refrigerators do not trip them. Even old ones didn't really - when fridges used to be notorious for tripping GFCIs, it was because the fridges actually had significant ground leakage. With modern fridges that don't fail like this, there is no need for concern. I know of at least four fridges that have been running on GFCIs continuously for years without a single nuisance trip. One of them is mine.

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Old 08-10-2009, 06:15 PM   #3
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Replacing 8-Conductor GFCI


Thanks for your response, mpoulton. I guess I should have mentioned that this GFCI was wired by the electrical contractors who worked on my remodel last year. Everything these guys did was perfect and haven't had any electrical issues, so I would assume that this outlet was wired this way for good reason. I guess I need to probe a little deeper and figure out if indeed there is a non-GFCI tap off the line side (as you suggested). This circuit is only supposed to be for garage plugs (all three of them), and all of them are on the load side of the GFCI.

Regarding your question "Why remove the GFCI at all?" : My concern is not with the fridge tripping the GFCI, but rather some other device (possibly a power tool) doing the tripping. If this were to happen and someone forgot to reset the GFCI (or didn't notice that it had tripped), then whatever was in the fridge could spoil. Not a chance I want to take.

Last edited by SalomonDIY; 08-10-2009 at 06:45 PM.
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Old 08-10-2009, 07:28 PM   #4
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Replacing 8-Conductor GFCI


Under the 2008 Code ALL garage receptacles need GFI protection, even ones for garage dorr openers. Leave the GFI in place. Food can be replaced, lives can't.
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Old 08-10-2009, 07:39 PM   #5
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Replacing 8-Conductor GFCI


... and they WILL all be GFI protected -- except the one where the fridge is connected.
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Old 08-11-2009, 01:56 AM   #6
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Replacing 8-Conductor GFCI


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... and they WILL all be GFI protected -- except the one where the fridge is connected.

Yeah right however as Jim Port mention 2008 NEC code everything on 120 volt circuits are required have GFCI and that do included the frige and frezzer no question asked and I am pretty sure your state allready on 2008 NEC code cycle I can able get ahold one person he do live in that state so, he can confirm this question to be on correct code cycle.

Merci,Marc
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Old 08-11-2009, 12:58 PM   #7
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Replacing 8-Conductor GFCI


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The 2008 NEC code everything on 120 volt circuits (In Unfinished Basements) are required have GFCI and that do included the frige and frezzer no question asked and I am pretty sure your state allready on 2008 NEC code cycle I can able get ahold one person he do live in that state so, he can confirm this question to be on correct code cycle. (Art.210.8(A)(5)) Exceptions NO 1 & NO 2 have been removed.



Merci,Marc
Marc, I edited your post as it could have confused someone. It sounded as if you meant all 120 volt receptacles.
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Old 08-11-2009, 01:05 PM   #8
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Replacing 8-Conductor GFCI


Washington was supposed to accept 2008 as of Jan 2009
As stated exceptions for fridges/freezers & other devices have been removed

Connect the downstream receptacles to the LINE side power & install GFCI's at those locations
The fridge will then be on its own GFCI

http://www.childoutletsafety.org/fil...doptionMap.pdf
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Old 08-11-2009, 07:48 PM   #9
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Replacing 8-Conductor GFCI


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Marc, I edited your post as it could have confused someone. It sounded as if you meant all 120 volt receptacles.

Thanks for edit it I did not catch fast engouh with it.

I don't know why it slipped from my mind due I deal with French codes and NEC codes get crossed over each other.

Merci,Marc
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Old 08-12-2009, 12:22 PM   #10
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Replacing 8-Conductor GFCI


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Thanks for edit it I did not catch fast engouh with it.

I don't know why it slipped from my mind due I deal with French codes and NEC codes get crossed over each other.

Merci,Marc
Marc. I knew what you meant. I was not sure some of the others would have. I am happy you did not mind........John

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