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Old 07-13-2013, 07:45 PM   #31
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relocating washer and dryer, bringing up to code cheaply?


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Originally Posted by gregzoll View Post
Do it what you think is best and easier for you. How far are you relocating the dryer from the current location that it is at now? As for the whole three wire vs. four wire argument, it was done, because NFPA stated that three wire was unsafe, and four wire was safer.

Same goes with why AFCI's are being pushed farther down everyone's throats under the 2014 code cycle, that all outlets in the structure have to be protected either by afci breakers or afci outlets.

I still have 10/2 on my dryer, which the run is probably 30 years old now. Just got around going from a hard wired dryer to actually installing the outlet and plug on that circuit. No fires yet, no shocks or magic smoke.

But yes, under current rules, if you relocate or have to pull a new circuit for a dryer, due to the wire becomes cut or insulation is breaking down, when tested with a MegaOhm tester, you are supposed to replace the run with 10/3.

To not cause further argument on this subject, which one person who I have blocked and is posting in reply to my comments, sell the 10/2 and go get 10/3, so you have no issues and as I stated before, easier is better, because then later on when you go to sell the place, and if the inspector sees a date stamp on that wire, or you have to get a CoA in your area, you the seller do not have to go through the hassle of pulling a whole new run of 10/3, because you used 10/2 for that dryer, to replace the old run.

To let you know, there are still hundreds if not thousands of dryers that are still on circuits using 10/2, and they are operating just fine, with no problems and no danger to life or property. Same goes for those stoves that are still using 10/2 or 8/2 for powering them. It is just that there are some out there that feel that you have to upgrade or update everything electric when the code changes, even though you can in some areas fall under "grandfathered" rules.
you are so not an electrician.... just saying. Guess the NEC handbook allows this, oh wait, it actually doesn't... must be someone that does not know how to read the NEC to begin with...

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Old 07-13-2013, 07:53 PM   #32
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relocating washer and dryer, bringing up to code cheaply?


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Originally Posted by Speedy Petey
OK, fine. But there is no mention about there being no distinction between ground and neutral. It just talks about 3-wire circuits being required to originate from the service panel. This is because of that neutral/ground bond I mentioned which is not allowed after the service panel.
Oh I agree I erroneously interjected the notion of no distinction. I had it all confused.
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Old 07-13-2013, 08:01 PM   #33
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relocating washer and dryer, bringing up to code cheaply?


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Fixen too is a true statement around these parts, just like jonesin, aint and yall!
As it is in my area....I actually say it a lot
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Old 07-13-2013, 08:05 PM   #34
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relocating washer and dryer, bringing up to code cheaply?


Fwiw, when I run my new dryer circuit I will run 10/3, install a four pin cord and receptacle and remove the ECG / neutral bond in the dryer. I will do this because it is code but also because it is safer. I don't want neutral current on the cabinet of anything in my home or the EGC system.
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Old 07-13-2013, 08:26 PM   #35
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Oodles,baby,I got oodles.
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Old 07-13-2013, 08:41 PM   #36
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relocating washer and dryer, bringing up to code cheaply?


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Fwiw, when I run my new dryer circuit I will run 10/3, install a four pin cord and receptacle and remove the ECG / neutral bond in the dryer. I will do this because it is code but also because it is safer. I don't want neutral current on the cabinet of anything in my home or the EGC system.
I remember when I was young mom screaming "dammit" every time she used the dryer she would use an oven mitt to unplug it until dad finally bought a new one.
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Old 07-13-2013, 09:17 PM   #37
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relocating washer and dryer, bringing up to code cheaply?


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I remember when I was young mom screaming "dammit" every time she used the dryer she would use an oven mitt to unplug it until dad finally bought a new one.
And that's really what it's all about. And the op wanted to do 4 pin way but with a non-code compliant wiring method. There is some reason two 10/2 cables in parallel is not permitted - one reason I can think of is the possibility of different length conductors. Or it would set someone up in the future for doing something even worse with the conductors. I have read enough crazy things on here that people are capable of doing that I can imagine an unused conductor being used for no good. At best I would think it would confuse the heck out of the next guy to work on it.
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Old 07-13-2013, 11:12 PM   #38
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relocating washer and dryer, bringing up to code cheaply?


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Marc I'm a newbie, are you saying that when the fault occurs it may do a lot of physical damage to the system.
Oui.,

There are few differnt way it can cause damage if you have bad ground connection or bad netural / ground conneciton on dryer some case it may not have enough current to force the breaker to trip out or pop the fuse out somecase I will call loose connection fault which it can actually heat up a bit.

That latter part is true if you have alot of ground conductors are not really tight and landed in proper place ( bootlegged ground is equally bad or worst )

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Old 07-14-2013, 01:27 PM   #39
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relocating washer and dryer, bringing up to code cheaply?


Would it be legal to remove the sheathing from the 10/2 and put 4 conductors in conduit?
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Old 07-14-2013, 01:28 PM   #40
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relocating washer and dryer, bringing up to code cheaply?


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Would it be legal to remove the sheathing from the 10/2 and put 4 conductors in conduit?
no. .......
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Old 07-14-2013, 01:30 PM   #41
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relocating washer and dryer, bringing up to code cheaply?


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Would it be legal to remove the sheathing from the 10/2 and put 4 conductors in conduit?
No, what gives you that idea? You use THHn/THWN in conduit.
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Old 07-14-2013, 01:40 PM   #42
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relocating washer and dryer, bringing up to code cheaply?


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Would it be legal to remove the sheathing from the 10/2 and put 4 conductors in conduit?
My understanding (which could be wrong) is no because the NEC requires the wiring to be certified (such as by the UL) and the UL never tested it that way. They only test and certify the entire cable as a whole. Some argue that the conductors in romex are THHN anyway but it doesn't matter because they are not listed individually by the UL.
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Old 07-15-2013, 08:00 AM   #43
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relocating washer and dryer, bringing up to code cheaply?


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No, what gives you that idea? You use THHn/THWN in conduit.
You will not find the conductors labeled under the sheath so you cannot assume they are THH anything.
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Old 07-15-2013, 10:54 AM   #44
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You will not find the conductors labeled under the sheath so you cannot assume they are THH anything.
If you do your research, the manufacturers have designed the jackets of the internal wires in the outer jacket, with the same jacket that is used for THHN/THWN.

Also if you read what I posted, I was answering their question about removing the wires from the jacket, and also stating that you use THHN/THWN in conduit, not the individual wires from the romex jacket. Gee, read next time.
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Old 07-15-2013, 12:40 PM   #45
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I was agreeing with you. Lighten up.

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