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Old 05-01-2013, 03:40 PM   #1
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Re-use a service entrance cable and grounding requirements


Hi. I'm finally getting the electric co. to disconnect my service on Friday so I can do my 100amp to 200amp main service upgrade. On my previous house we did a 200amp to 400amp upgrade (had electrician do it) and I still have the 200amp service cable from that. My question:

1) Can I reuse my previous 200amp service cable? The markings on it are as follows:

CAPWIRE 2CDRS 4/0 AL 1 CDR 2/0 AL TYPE SE CABLE STYLE U RHW or RHH CDRS 300v TO GROUND (UL)


Also, I want to make sure I fully understand the grounding requirements for the new 200amp service panel? I will do a #6 wire to the metal pipe coming in from the well water supply and I plan to also hammer in some copper rod(s).

2) How many rods should there be in total?

3) Can I leave the existing copper rod in place and add to it?

4) How far apart should the rods be located (from each other)?

5) How long should the new rod(s) be?

6) What size wire should I use to tie the rods to each other and then back to the panel?

7) Anything else I should be aware of when doing this upgrade?

Thank you for your assistance very much!!!

Keith

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Old 05-01-2013, 04:16 PM   #2
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Re-use a service entrance cable and grounding requirements


You are going to need two 8' rods driven at least 6' apart and flush or below the surface of the ground. You can use #6 to the rods. For the water line you will need #4 to within 5' of where it enters the building.

Whether you can reuse the cable depends on its condition. I would not install old weathered cable to save a few bucks now and need to replace it shortly thereafter.

You will also need to provide an intersystem bonding terminal for the phone and cable systems.

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Old 05-01-2013, 05:08 PM   #3
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Re-use a service entrance cable and grounding requirements


Thanks for the quick reply, Jim!

I know nothing about the intersystem connection bond so I did some quick research. The house doesn't have cable yet and it won't have phone since the phone service is through the cable. We might go with satelite but we aren't sure.

Do I need to provide this intersystem bond now before we decide if we are going with cable or satellite? We would like to make that decision after we move into the house (after final electrical inspection). Either way, is the cable company responsible for grounding the cable line at the service entrance?
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Old 05-01-2013, 05:11 PM   #4
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Re-use a service entrance cable and grounding requirements


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Thanks for the quick reply, Jim!

I know nothing about the intersystem connection bond so I did some quick research. The house doesn't have cable yet and it won't have phone since the phone service is through the cable. We might go with satelite but we aren't sure.

Do I need to provide this intersystem bond now before we decide if we are going with cable or satellite? We would like to make that decision after we move into the house (after final electrical inspection). Either way, is the cable company responsible for grounding the cable line at the service entrance?
You need to install it regardless, but the funny thing is, most other utilities won't use it... Not everyone is up to speed yet... lol...
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Old 05-01-2013, 05:18 PM   #5
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Re-use a service entrance cable and grounding requirements


The code also makes you install at least one phone jack too. Timely change as more and more move away from landlines.
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Old 05-01-2013, 05:32 PM   #6
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Re-use a service entrance cable and grounding requirements


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The code also makes you install at least one phone jack too. Timely change as more and more move away from landlines.
Really? So I need to install a phone jack in the house...can it be in the basement?
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Old 05-01-2013, 05:35 PM   #7
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Re-use a service entrance cable and grounding requirements


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The code also makes you install at least one phone jack too. Timely change as more and more move away from landlines.
What NEC section?
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Old 05-01-2013, 05:50 PM   #8
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Re-use a service entrance cable and grounding requirements


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Whether you can reuse the cable depends on its condition.
the cable is in good condition - I just wanted to make sure it was appropriately sized.
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Old 05-01-2013, 06:38 PM   #9
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The code Article regarding the phone jack is 800.156 in the 2008 and 2011 NEC. It applies to new construction. It was a new change to the 2008.
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Old 05-01-2013, 07:50 PM   #10
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The code Article regarding the phone jack is 800.156 in the 2008 and 2011 NEC. It applies to new construction. It was a new change to the 2008.
hmmm - I guess this doesn't apply to gutting an existing house and put an addition on?
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Old 05-01-2013, 08:20 PM   #11
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I would question my local inspector for their take on this.
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Old 05-02-2013, 03:56 PM   #12
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Re-use a service entrance cable and grounding requirements


A few more things:

1) Do I need to apply any type of conductive grease to the meter terminals / service panel terminals?

2) Is the #6 ground wire for the 8' copper rods supposed to be bare copper or can it have the typical black vinyl wrap?

3) Does it matter what type of screws I use to fasten the meter box to the wall and to fasten the cable clamps? Some guy was telling me I needed to use stainless steel??

4) clamping the main feed: Is a cable clamp that clamps the main cable service cable against the outside wall required within 12" of the meter box cable clamp?

5) last question: My guess is more is better but does code care if you have more than 2 grounding methods? It appears that there is an existing #4 UFER ground (I dug down about 8" and I couldn't find a rod). So I still drove in my copper grounding rods with #6 wire and I also have the materials to ground to the water line (#4 wire).


THANKS!!!
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Old 05-03-2013, 09:03 AM   #13
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Re-use a service entrance cable and grounding requirements


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Originally Posted by CapeCod153 View Post
A few more things:

1) Do I need to apply any type of conductive grease to the meter terminals / service panel terminals?

2) Is the #6 ground wire for the 8' copper rods supposed to be bare copper or can it have the typical black vinyl wrap?

3) Does it matter what type of screws I use to fasten the meter box to the wall and to fasten the cable clamps? Some guy was telling me I needed to use stainless steel??

4) clamping the main feed: Is a cable clamp that clamps the main cable service cable against the outside wall required within 12" of the meter box cable clamp?

5) last question: My guess is more is better but does code care if you have more than 2 grounding methods? It appears that there is an existing #4 UFER ground (I dug down about 8" and I couldn't find a rod). So I still drove in my copper grounding rods with #6 wire and I also have the materials to ground to the water line (#4 wire).


THANKS!!!
1) Use anti-oxidizing compound; Noalox, Penetrox, etc

2) I've always used bare, but check which is cheaper. Bare, insulated, covered- any 3 are acceptable.

3) Screws- I'm guessing that this is outside, so definitely use non-rusting screws. That guy gave you good advice.

4) Support cable within 12" of box, and not more than 4 1/2' between supports thereafter.

5) The NEC does not require a supplemental grounding electrode when there is more than one main grounding electrode. So, if you've already drove the ground rods and ran the #6, go ahead and tie into the panel. Not necessary, but it doesn't hurt either. The water service needs to be connected to the panel with the #4 wire. Bond the water and UFER ground with a #4 wire to form the grounding electrode system.
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Old 05-03-2013, 12:27 PM   #14
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Re-use a service entrance cable and grounding requirements


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1) Bond the water and UFER ground with a #4 wire to form the grounding electrode system.
What is the best way to do this? BTW, the UFER ground wire is AWG 3, so even thicker than I originally thought.
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Old 05-03-2013, 01:24 PM   #15
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Re-use a service entrance cable and grounding requirements


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The code Article regarding the phone jack is 800.156 in the 2008 and 2011 NEC. It applies to new construction. It was a new change to the 2008.
Jim, I never knew that. Learn something new everyday!

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