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Old 06-12-2012, 12:15 AM   #16
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Push In Connectors


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Originally Posted by Semi-Retired El View Post
IMO the "pinch" connection would not survive a dead short on a 20A breaker so if I left them in a fixture it would be the connection to only that fixture, not a feed-thru.
I have two data points that say otherwise: A dead short on a 20A 277V lighting circuit out of a panel with 22kA fault current available, and the connectors were fine. Also, a dead short in a 20A 480V water heater circuit (at the end of about 150' of #12) and everything survived with no damage.

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Old 06-12-2012, 07:15 AM   #17
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My main reasons for asking an inspector about them would be to find out if the local jurisdiction has legally banned them or have others had problems with them.

IMO the "pinch" connection would not survive a dead short on a 20A breaker so if I left them in a fixture it would be the connection to only that fixture, not a feed-thru.

They're a close "cuzzin" to "back-stabbed receptacles which IMO are nothing but trouble, but are still legal w/ #14.
While the concept is the same, the methodology to accomplish the connection is quite different. The push in connector has a flat surface in contact with the conductor for the entire stripped length unlike the backstab where you only have the edge of the spring in contact with the conductor. I would think a testing lab has subjected the connectors to fault currents as well as high continuous loads to ensure the connectors did not melt down.
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Old 06-12-2012, 07:18 AM   #18
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I have two data points that say otherwise: A dead short on a 20A 277V lighting circuit out of a panel with 22kA fault current available, and the connectors were fine. Also, a dead short in a 20A 480V water heater circuit (at the end of about 150' of #12) and everything survived with no damage.
Did you dis-assemble the connectors to see if they was missing metal?
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Old 06-12-2012, 07:29 AM   #19
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Some brands have a clear shell and you can see the spring material. This allows you to ensure the conductor is fully inserted.
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Old 06-12-2012, 07:29 AM   #20
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Here's my take.

Years ago the company I worked for had a customer who was a suit for Gardner Bender. We became a way of testing their new products. One of the products were these type connectors. We had many, many failures. Over the years, I am fairly certain they have worked out the design flaws and some people swear by them, but I am still a little bit hesitant to fully support them.

Other than just my basic feelings towards them, I prefer wirenuts. I have read that some of these style connectors are one time use. I would hate to have to snip all the wires, or struggle removing all the wires just to meter something. Which brings up the next point, metering splices. Much easier with a wirenut than with a full Wago.

I think I could see myself using a larger Wago for pigtailing grounds, but I don't see myself using them for much else.
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Old 06-12-2012, 07:33 AM   #21
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There are also test ports to allow a probe to be inserted even with all the ports filled.

Do you reuse wire nuts?
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Old 06-12-2012, 07:34 AM   #22
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There are also test ports to allow a probe to be inserted even with all the ports filled.

Do you reuse wire nuts?
Very often. Now is when you tell me that they also say not to reuse.
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Old 06-12-2012, 08:17 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Semi-Retired El View Post
My main reasons for asking an inspector about them would be to find out if the local jurisdiction has legally banned them or have others had problems with them.

IMO the "pinch" connection would not survive a dead short on a 20A breaker so if I left them in a fixture it would be the connection to only that fixture, not a feed-thru.

They're a close "cuzzin" to "back-stabbed receptacles which IMO are nothing but trouble, but are still legal w/ #14.

I felt the same way when I first saw them. Looking at it from my stand point as an inspector, if it listed and labeled, and installed per the manufacturers, I have to accept it. I do not have the luxury of "because I said so", and any inspector who thinks that way is ignorant. It doesn't always make me popular, but I am respected.
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Old 06-12-2012, 10:38 AM   #24
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Everything you've posted to be taken with a grain of salt by everyone else. You are in Chicago and everything in Chicago is backwards and done to make things more expensive and requires several different union trades to do anything! Someday maybe you guys will catch up with reality and not require conduit for residential use, allows things that have been standard everywhere else in the nation for decades and realize that unions are no longer better than anyone else.
Another Appalachian hillbilly that has no clue.
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Old 06-12-2012, 11:59 AM   #25
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I don't reuse wirenuts. The reason is that about 25% of the time, when I remove one that is well-torqued, the spring falls out. I figure that there's no need to be cheap over an inexpensive item by retaining it the other 75% of the time it doesn't fail.
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Old 06-12-2012, 12:59 PM   #26
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Another Appalachian hillbilly that has no clue.
Not quite, I'm originally from New York and then lived in South Carolina before moving to France and finely Kentucky. If you know anything about the codes in the Chicago area he would certainly agree! They are some of the most backward and not consumer friendly codes in the United States.
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Old 06-12-2012, 11:42 PM   #27
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Did you dis-assemble the connectors to see if they was missing metal?
No, but we pulled a couple out of the boxes and looked at them because we were concerned. There was no visible change and the wires were held tight.
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Old 06-13-2012, 07:34 AM   #28
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I felt the same way when I first saw them. Looking at it from my stand point as an inspector, if it listed and labeled, and installed per the manufacturers, I have to accept it. I do not have the luxury of "because I said so", and any inspector who thinks that way is ignorant. It doesn't always make me popular, but I am respected.
Since an AHJ has the final say, if done legally, does your Jurisdiction ever go tighter than the Code?
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Old 06-13-2012, 03:04 PM   #29
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Since an AHJ has the final say, if done legally, does your Jurisdiction ever go tighter than the Code?
That's just it. The AHJ does NOT have "the final say". WHY do so many people think this.

He CANNOT just say "That is not allowed because I don't like it."
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Old 06-13-2012, 03:16 PM   #30
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"That is not allowed because I don't like it."
True, unless you are married, the question is something domestic related, and your wife is saying it. That AHJ/wife never budges.

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