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Old 10-19-2011, 01:09 PM   #1
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Power to Shed / Workshop


Hello,

I've seen a lot of threads about installing sub panels. My shed is about 60 feet from my main panel. I'm wondering, why can't we just run a couple 12/2 (with ground) Romex cables directly to the shed, and not use a sub panel?

Thanks in advance for advise.

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Old 10-19-2011, 01:21 PM   #2
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Power to Shed / Workshop


Because of this:

II. Buildings or Other Structures Supplied by a
Feeder(s) or Branch Circuit(s)
225.30 Number of Supplies. A building or other structure
that is served by a branch circuit or feeder on the load side
of a service disconnecting means shall be supplied by only
one feeder or branch circuit unless permitted in 225.30(A)
through (E). For the purpose of this section, a multiwire
branch circuit shall be considered a single circuit.
Where a branch circuit or feeder originates in these
additional buildings or other structures, only one feeder or
branch circuit shall be permitted to supply power back to
the original building or structure, unless permitted in
225.30(A) through (E).
For the purpose of this section, a multiwire branch circuit
shall be considered a single circuit.

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Old 10-19-2011, 04:01 PM   #3
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Power to Shed / Workshop


Quote:
Originally Posted by Code05
Because of this:

II. Buildings or Other Structures Supplied by a
Feeder(s) or Branch Circuit(s)
225.30 Number of Supplies. A building or other structure
that is served by a branch circuit or feeder on the load side
of a service disconnecting means shall be supplied by only
one feeder or branch circuit unless permitted in 225.30(A)
through (E). For the purpose of this section, a multiwire
branch circuit shall be considered a single circuit.
Where a branch circuit or feeder originates in these
additional buildings or other structures, only one feeder or
branch circuit shall be permitted to supply power back to
the original building or structure, unless permitted in
225.30(A) through (E).
For the purpose of this section, a multiwire branch circuit
shall be considered a single circuit.
Sometimes I hate the way the NEC words these things! Are they referring to the Sub as one big MWBC?
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Old 10-19-2011, 04:56 PM   #4
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Power to Shed / Workshop


err, thanks Code05. But I'm left without more understanding. I suppose on resale it'd be best to have everything done by the regs. I can live with that.
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Old 10-19-2011, 05:28 PM   #5
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You can NOT run "a couple of 12/2" cables, but you CAN install a single 12/3!

That will give you the equivalent of 2 circuits, but you will need to use a double-pole breaker at the house, and a suitable disconnect at the shed.

A standard 2-pole toggle switch should suffice for your disconnecting means at the shed. I prefer to use a switch guard to minimize accidentally switching off the power:

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Old 10-19-2011, 07:52 PM   #6
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Thanks Sparky! ...but does that satisfy the stuff that code05 quoted from the regs?
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Old 10-19-2011, 08:02 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thomlep View Post
Thanks Sparky! ...but does that satisfy the stuff that code05 quoted from the regs?
Yes, that satisfies the code.
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Old 10-19-2011, 08:42 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunny B. View Post
Sometimes I hate the way the NEC words these things! Are they referring to the Sub as one big MWBC?
The NEC is a legal document, not a novel or magazine-it is what it is.

There is no such thing as a sub-panel in the NEC. Only Panelboards.

Go to your definitions in Article 100 and look up MWBC, Branch circuit, and Feeder.
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Old 09-14-2013, 01:24 PM   #9
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Thanks again @kbsparky !

So, I finally got around to this power-to-shed project. I have a two-pole 20-amp breaker. I will purchase 60ft of 12/3 UF cable to run to shed. This will give me two 20 amp circuits at the shed. Am I saying this right?

Thanks!
-Tom

Last edited by thomlep; 09-14-2013 at 07:15 PM. Reason: typo
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Old 09-14-2013, 04:47 PM   #10
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I assume you mean "UF" cable? And that you'll be burying it? I'd also buy more than 60 ft.
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Old 09-14-2013, 07:17 PM   #11
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yes, UF cable. The kind you can put in the ground. Shed is about 50ft from the main board.
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Old 09-15-2013, 04:21 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Code05 View Post
The NEC is a legal document, not a novel or magazine-it is what it is.

There is no such thing as a sub-panel in the NEC. Only Panelboards.

Go to your definitions in Article 100 and look up MWBC, Branch circuit, and Feeder.

Exhibit 250.46 An installation in which the isolated equipment grounding conductor is allowed to pass through the subpanel without connecting to the grounding bus to terminate at the service grounding bus.
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Old 09-15-2013, 08:36 AM   #13
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Power to Shed / Workshop


Thanks for your reply on this DIYchatroom!
Do I need a "subpanel" I have a 20-amp, two-pole breaker on the main board.

Couple questions:
1) Why would I need a "sub panel" (panelboard) at the shed?
2) why not just branch-off the 12/3 UF cable into the two circuits in the shed?

By these questions, I'm not suggesting a preference, I just want to do it right.

Thanks in advance for all your responses!
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Old 09-15-2013, 10:01 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thomlep View Post
Thanks for your reply on this DIYchatroom!
Do I need a "subpanel" I have a 20-amp, two-pole breaker on the main board.

Couple questions:
1) Why would I need a "sub panel" (panelboard) at the shed?
2) why not just branch-off the 12/3 UF cable into the two circuits in the shed?

By these questions, I'm not suggesting a preference, I just want to do it right.

Thanks in advance for all your responses!
If you are running a MWBC, then no, you do not need a sub-panel, if you run a feeder, then YES, you do need a sub-panel.
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Old 09-15-2013, 10:33 AM   #15
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You do need a disconnect. A two pole switch (for MWBC) will do the trick.

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