Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > Home Improvement > Electrical

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 01-01-2013, 06:07 PM   #1
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: New Jersey, USA
Posts: 1,205
Rewards Points: 506
Default

Portable generator grounding


Hi;
Portable generator instructions are to connect ground terminal on generator to ground rod outside house.
Does this apply if the generator is not connected to any of the permanent house wiring; using extension cords (#12 3-wire outdoor cord)?

I cannot see how grounding the generator will reduce my chances of being electrocuted. As a matter of fact, I would think it would improve my chances of being electrocuted, since now I have a ground reference, and if I should be standing on the ground outside and come in contact with a hot wire, there would be a circuit between hot and neutral through me!
If the generator is not grounded, then that path is less direct. Yes; if the generator is sitting on the ground, and the chassis is bonded to neutral, then there will still be a path through me, but a higher resistance than if the generator is connected directly to earth via grounding rod.

FW

__________________

KE2KB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-01-2013, 06:33 PM   #2
Licensed Electrical Cont.
 
Speedy Petey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: NY State
Posts: 6,877
Rewards Points: 2,108
Default

Portable generator grounding


Using just the receptacles on the generator you DO NOT need or want to connect to a ground rod. It will serve NO purpose or benefit.

__________________
Sometimes I feel like if I answer any more questions it is like someone trying to climb over a fence to jump off a bridge and me giving them a boost.
Answers based on the 2008 & 2011 NEC.
Speedy Petey is online now   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Speedy Petey For This Useful Post:
J. V. (01-02-2013), stickboy1375 (02-16-2013)
Old 01-01-2013, 06:57 PM   #3
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: New Jersey, USA
Posts: 1,205
Rewards Points: 506
Default

Portable generator grounding


Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedy Petey View Post
Using just the receptacles on the generator you DO NOT need or want to connect to a ground rod. It will serve NO purpose or benefit.
Thank you.

FW
__________________

KE2KB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-01-2013, 07:08 PM   #4
Master Electrician
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Indiana
Posts: 2,951
Rewards Points: 2,158
Default

Portable generator grounding



Here's an interesting twist.
brric is online now   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to brric For This Useful Post:
Speedy Petey (01-01-2013), stickboy1375 (02-16-2013)
Old 01-01-2013, 07:25 PM   #5
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 288
Rewards Points: 250
Default

Portable generator grounding


When I encounterred the instruction to ground my generator purchased during Hurricane Sandy, I assumed it had something to do with a lightning strike. It sounded similar to the instruction to ground my TV antenna and in fact I used the same grounding pole which I drove into the ground about 8 ft. (I no longer have the antenna since I picked up cable.)
Sounds like I was wrong. Correct?
__________________
Being human is the result of heredity.
Being humane is a matter of choice.
retired guy 60 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-01-2013, 07:38 PM   #6
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: New Hampshire, USA
Posts: 426
Rewards Points: 254
Default

Portable generator grounding


Quote:
Originally Posted by brric View Post

Here's an interesting twist.
Oh. My. God.

LOL!
__________________
Pardon any typos, my IPad has a mind of it's own for spelling corrections!
dougp23 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-01-2013, 09:02 PM   #7
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: New Jersey, USA
Posts: 1,205
Rewards Points: 506
Default

Portable generator grounding


Quote:
Originally Posted by brric View Post

Here's an interesting twist.
Portable ground. Love it! Works on the same principle as "wireless ESD strap", right?
Thanks for the post. That image made my day!
__________________


Last edited by KE2KB; 01-01-2013 at 09:10 PM.
KE2KB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-01-2013, 09:04 PM   #8
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: New Jersey, USA
Posts: 1,205
Rewards Points: 506
Default

Portable generator grounding


Quote:
Originally Posted by retired guy 60 View Post
When I encounterred the instruction to ground my generator purchased during Hurricane Sandy, I assumed it had something to do with a lightning strike. It sounded similar to the instruction to ground my TV antenna and in fact I used the same grounding pole which I drove into the ground about 8 ft. (I no longer have the antenna since I picked up cable.)
Sounds like I was wrong. Correct?
Well, if I ever do install a transfer switch and connect the genny to it, I can just run the ground to the same rod as the SE uses. My antenna (2 meter amateur) is connected to that same rod too.

FW
__________________

KE2KB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-02-2013, 10:51 AM   #9
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 288
Rewards Points: 250
Default

Portable generator grounding


I won't be using a transfer switch. But during the Hurricane Sandy, I did wire my generator directly to the washing machine for a period of time which I know has a grounded plug. If anyone can help explain how the washing machine would operate more safely by not grounding the generator, I would appreciate it. It is my understanding that grounding provides an alternate direction for current to travel in the event a hot wire in the washing machine (actually any major appliance) should touch the appliance's frame. As I understand it, and I could be wrong, grounding the generator serves the same function as grounding the service panel. For the purpose of this question we will assume there is no GFCI outlet being used in conjunction with the generator.
__________________
Being human is the result of heredity.
Being humane is a matter of choice.
retired guy 60 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-02-2013, 01:05 PM   #10
Member
 
Oso954's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Northern Calif.
Posts: 1,731
Rewards Points: 1,342
Default

Portable generator grounding


Some light reading for Retired Guy. http://oshaprofessor.com/Portable%20...rds%203-05.pdf
Oso954 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Oso954 For This Useful Post:
retired guy 60 (01-02-2013)
Old 01-02-2013, 03:34 PM   #11
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 288
Rewards Points: 250
Default

Portable generator grounding


Oso954:
Thanks for the light reading. I did read it carefully. I also checked the booklet that came with my Powermate generator. I won't copy the entire paragraph but the booklet says, "The National Electric Code requires that this product be properly grounded to an appropriate earth ground to help prevent electric shock." Then it goes on to say that a minimum 12 AWG wire be connected to a copper rod driven into the ground. I tried to question the manufacturer by phone but got tired being on hold.
I don't doubt the accuracy of the document you referred to but I noticed that it specifically refers to generator use on a worksite where the worker is holding a drill with a fault while standing on the ground near the generator. I am not nitpicking but could the warning about not grounding the generator apply strickly to the circumstances cited and not to an extension cord enterring a home and powering indoor heavy appliances?
Rest assured I am not questioning your explanation nor the opinion of Speedy Petey. I am just trying to understand how the manufacturer of my 6000 watt generator (Powermate PMO126000) could give advice that appears to be dangerous and then justify that advice by citing the NEC.
It does say at the end of the paragraph, "However, consult with a local electrician to insure that local codes are being adhered to." I guess this is the escape clause in the event a consumer bites the dust.
__________________
Being human is the result of heredity.
Being humane is a matter of choice.
retired guy 60 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-02-2013, 04:29 PM   #12
Licensed Electrical Cont.
 
Speedy Petey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: NY State
Posts: 6,877
Rewards Points: 2,108
Default

Portable generator grounding


The earth IS NOT and should NOT be a path for fault current back to the source. Connecting a genset to the dirt it sits on will do NOTHING in the case of a fault to your washer case and will only send voltage into the dirt.
The instructions that say to connect to a ground rod to prevent shock are erroneous at best, and the NEC says nothing of the sort.
__________________
Sometimes I feel like if I answer any more questions it is like someone trying to climb over a fence to jump off a bridge and me giving them a boost.
Answers based on the 2008 & 2011 NEC.
Speedy Petey is online now   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Speedy Petey For This Useful Post:
retired guy 60 (01-02-2013)
Old 01-02-2013, 04:35 PM   #13
Member
 
Oso954's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Northern Calif.
Posts: 1,731
Rewards Points: 1,342
Default

Portable generator grounding


As long as you are talking about using it as a portable generator (extension cord and drill or appliance plugged into the ext. cord), just consider it an overstatement by whoever wrote it.
Oso954 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Oso954 For This Useful Post:
retired guy 60 (01-02-2013)
Old 02-16-2013, 01:26 PM   #14
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 190
Rewards Points: 150
Default

Portable generator grounding


I think thats the exact same generator as what I just bought. Mine is black with some purple on it. Might not be the exact same thing but mine is also a 6000 watter. It does say in the instructions about grounding it. I have mine wired up to a generator ready load center using an power inlet box thats out in my shed. So in my case I would need to use a grouinding rod. I was thinking of digging a 2 1/2' deep by 8' long trench to bury the rod. Then run a ground in which would come in from the floor and have a plate there. I could then run the ground wire from the frame to that plate. I wanted to do it this way just incase I wanted to move the generator to a different location (maybe outside the shed or whatnot) and wouldnt have a super long wire I had to disconnect.

Jason34 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Preventing portable AC leaks Anesthesiologis Appliances 2 07-20-2012 11:21 PM
Portable Gen Set - Home Connections & Distance ArtF Electrical 1 06-15-2012 11:54 PM
2FT water in my basement, Need help finding a good portable sump pump willowgirl Plumbing 9 03-03-2010 11:12 AM
Portable saw Question Gettingintoit Tools 10 11-03-2008 08:45 AM
Portable air conditioners; who's got one? (No draining! Yet most say draining req'd?) Deck Appliances 1 07-16-2008 11:33 PM




Top of Page | View New Posts

Copyright © 2003-2014 Escalate Media. All Rights Reserved.