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Old 03-26-2013, 01:45 AM   #1
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Please help with can light layout: Bedroom & Closet


All,

I'm having a devil of a time deciding on a can light layout for my bedroom remodel. The new master bedroom will be 13'x16' with an adjoined master closet that is 7'-6"x11'-6" with closet shelving on all three sides, ceilings are 7'-8".

I'm thinking of installing either 4" or 5" LED can lights in the bedroom (the new Lithonia LED kits), and definitely 4" LED cans in the closet.

First question:
What size can light is recommended for a 7'-8" ceiling? I'm thinking that the 4" cans might look more delicate with this low ceiling. Any recommendations?

Second question:
For a bedroom application, what is the recommended spacing for 4-5" can lights? I've seen 4' recommended spacing, which would be 12 4" cans in this room! This seems like overkill to me, am I off base? Would it be weird to arrange the lights in a horseshoe pattern around the bed?

Last question:
While the closet is 7'-6"x11'-6", with the closet shelving on three sides, the open floor space becomes 4'-0"x9'-6". I'm sure that I can space the lights on the long opening (roughly 2'6"-4'6"-2'6"). My concern is back-lighting when standing in front of the closet shelving. Would four 4" cans spaced 2" apart be recommended for even lighting?

I know these are a lot of questions, but I've searched quite a bit online and found little constructive for my situation. Any advice is appreciated. Thanks for looking.

-Kiel

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Old 03-26-2013, 02:02 AM   #2
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Please help with can light layout: Bedroom & Closet


I ain't much help, but there's a post at Electrician Talk that may be similar enough to give you some ideas to think about. You won't be able to ask questions there as it is for pros, but you should be able to read the posts, then come back here with more questions.

Good Luck


Last edited by sirsparksalot; 03-26-2013 at 02:04 AM. Reason: typo in link
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Old 03-26-2013, 06:08 AM   #3
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Please help with can light layout: Bedroom & Closet


Closets benefit from surface mounted lighting fixtures more than recessed cans. They throw off light better, vs a can throws mainly down light.
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Old 03-26-2013, 06:32 AM   #4
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Please help with can light layout: Bedroom & Closet


Also you'll want to bring into the equation the output of the LEDs, i.e. a 9w LED vs. a 15w LED puts out vastly different amounts of light. We just put can lights in our master bedroom, which is somewhat similar sized with a smaller closet. We have 6x5" cans with 13w Compact Fluorescents (roughly 1000 lumens, or similar wattage for LEDs), a 3 way switched fan (with lights) in the middle, a single 5" can in the closet. Just for your reference... And that is a lot of light. I'm also going to do sconces on the wall on either side of the bed so we can flip the light on before getting into bed, and then turn it off at the bed.
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Old 03-26-2013, 10:56 AM   #5
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Please help with can light layout: Bedroom & Closet


Quote:
Originally Posted by Optical1 View Post
What size can light is recommended for a 7'-8" ceiling? I'm thinking that the 4" cans might look more delicate with this low ceiling. Any recommendations?
With a lower ceiling, I would put on the smaller side. 4" or 5", just not 6".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Optical1 View Post
12 4" cans in this room! This seems like overkill to me, am I off base?
I agree. Too many. 8. 4x2 would be nice. Even 6 - 3x2. It's a bedroom you don't need it to be lit up like an office. I put 4-5 in small bedrooms and it is nice and bright. Yours is a little bigger so a few more is fine but not 12.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Optical1 View Post
Would it be weird to arrange the lights in a horseshoe pattern around the bed?
No, sounds like an interesting design. Depends on your plan. As long as it still works if you put the bed on a different wall. Would it be weird then or limit you to one arrangement? If so I'd keep it simple and down the sides.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Optical1 View Post
Would four 4" cans spaced 2" apart be recommended for even lighting?
I think 4 sounds good. You should place them so they are, I'd say, 18" o.c. from the wall. Your closet bars will be at 12", so you want these right over where your clothes will hang in front of the bar but also in front of you when looking at the clothes.

I put two 4" LED cans in slider closets in that config and it is very nice and bright. So much nicer than the typical Chicago style of a pull-string bulb fixture. {Edit} Actually, rethinking this. With 4'x10' walkable, I'd put in 6 if you go 4". 3 on each side. If you bump to 5" then 4 would be ok.

HTH!
-mike

Last edited by SquishyBall; 03-26-2013 at 11:17 AM.
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Old 04-16-2013, 05:57 PM   #6
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Please help with can light layout: Bedroom & Closet


Thanks everyone for providing feedback on the layout. I've played around with the layout, and I think I've found a plan that I like:

Please help with can light layout: Bedroom & Closet-lunsford-mb.jpg

It is not symmetrical in the bedroom, but I if the lighting coverage were to be inconsistent, I could always add one or two more cans pretty easily.

I'm planning to either install the Lithonia 4" or 5" LED kits (4" here and 5" here) with a couple of the Lithonia 4" Directional LED kits from HD (here). I like the fact that they are an LED retrofit kit, and are IC out of the box. Does anyone suggest against using these, or have a better suggestion?

It looks like the 4" use a 9W lamp at 400 lumens, while the 5" uses a 15W lamp at 550 lumens. If I went with the 4" layout, I would likely use the layout above, whereas if I went with the 5" I would likely go with 6 cans on a 2 x 3 pattern in the bedroom and keep the 4" cans in the closet.

Any thoughts or suggestions are welcome.

Thanks for looking!

-Kiel
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Old 04-16-2013, 06:31 PM   #7
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Please help with can light layout: Bedroom & Closet


I think trying to light a room with 4" recessed is a poor design. It will take too many compared to larger lights. The cone of light will be very thin, even more so with the low ceilings. The 4" are fine for accent or task lights.

I will see if I can find the closet light graphic showing the exclusionary zones for lighting.

Here you go.

http://www.google.com/imgres?q=close...10&tx=56&ty=69
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Answers based on the National Electrical Code. Local amendments may apply. Check with your local building officials.
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Old 04-16-2013, 06:48 PM   #8
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Please help with can light layout: Bedroom & Closet


Thanks for your feedback Jim. I tried another layout - would you suggest something more similar to this?

Please help with can light layout: Bedroom & Closet-lunsford-mb-2.jpg

Also, am I reading the chart and description that you pointed me to about closet lighting that I am to stay 12" or the extent of the shelf away from the walls when installing recessed fixtures? (Since the lighting is recessed, I wouldn't need to worry about the extent of the clothing?

Thanks again,
Kiel
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Old 04-16-2013, 09:09 PM   #9
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Please help with can light layout: Bedroom & Closet


Use this inconjunction with the graphic above,

410.16 Luminaires in Clothes Closets.
(A) Luminaire Types Permitted.
Only luminaires of the
following types shall be permitted in a closet:
(1) Surface-mounted or recessed incandescent or LED luminaires
with completely enclosed light sources
(2) Surface-mounted or recessed fluorescent luminaires
(3) Surface-mounted fluorescent or LED luminaires identified
as suitable for installation within the closet storage
space

(B) Luminaire Types Not Permitted.
Incandescent luminaires
with open or partially enclosed lamps and pendant
luminaires or lampholders shall not be permitted.

(C) Location.
The minimum clearance between luminaires
installed in clothes closets and the nearest point of a closet
storage space shall be as follows:
(1) 300 mm (12 in.) for surface-mounted incandescent or
LED luminaires with a completely enclosed light source
installed on the wall above the door or on the ceiling.
(2) 150 mm (6 in.) for surface-mounted fluorescent luminaires
installed on the wall above the door or on the
ceiling.
(3) 150 mm (6 in.) for recessed incandescent or LED luminaires
with a completely enclosed light source installed
in the wall or the ceiling.
(4) 150 mm (6 in.) for recessed fluorescent luminaires installed
in the wall or the ceiling.
(5) Surface-mounted fluorescent or LED luminaires shall
be permitted to be installed within the closet storage

space where identified for this use.

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