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Old 06-04-2013, 09:03 PM   #61
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Pendant and Can install; ran into problem need help


I'd like to ask one more question before I put this thread to rest...

I just found out that my kitchen island needs an outlet. Apparently. Our island has no power, and it was that way when we bought it and our inspector didn't mention anything about it: fantastic.

Should I just leave it be and not worry about it until it comes time to sell, or is it something worth doing now?

We're on a slab foundation and I have extra flooring and enough cable to get the job done. I'm also unemployed so I have a lot of free time LOL.

BTW: can NM cable be reused once it is removed? Specifically, older cable. I'd rather reuse it than recycle it.

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Old 06-04-2013, 09:29 PM   #62
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Please whatever you do, do NOT run cable under a flooring system of any kind, just too many hazards.
Personally I would not worry about the island outlet, unless you really want it or need it, you would have to cut the concrete, install conduit, and run UF wire, or single conductors rated for wet location. Romex is not.

I would use old wire for tieing ladders to a ladder rack, not re using for household wiring

Sorry to hear about your 'extended vacation', you seem to be a go getter, I'm sure something will turn up soon
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Old 06-04-2013, 09:44 PM   #63
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Pendant and Can install; ran into problem need help


Yes, code requires the island to have an outlet. With a slab floor it will be A LOT OF WORK involving pulling up flooring cutting a channel in the slab at least big enough for armored cable in the slab and then redoing. You can't use romex, either THHN in conduit, or armored cable. Whether it is important enough and you need it enough to do now or not is up to you. This is like the above issue, code requires 2 small appliance branch circuits, you now have one, but it currently doesn't seem to be causing you trouble.

Unfortunately inspectors don't catch everything. Ours missed the fact that the hot water had been re-piped, but they forgot to run it to the washer, so the washing machine had no hot water. I told our realtor (family friend) and he said "Why do you
need hot water for the washer?" We had our 1st baby on the way. We told his wife, they had a plumber out the next day.

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Old 06-04-2013, 11:01 PM   #64
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Yes, code requires the island to have an outlet. With a slab floor it will be A LOT OF WORK involving pulling up flooring cutting a channel in the slab at least big enough for armored cable in the slab and then redoing. You can't use romex, either THHN in conduit, or armored cable. Whether it is important enough and you need it enough to do now or not is up to you. This is like the above issue, code requires 2 small appliance branch circuits, you now have one, but it currently doesn't seem to be causing you trouble.

Unfortunately inspectors don't catch everything. Ours missed the fact that the hot water had been re-piped, but they forgot to run it to the washer, so the washing machine had no hot water. I told our realtor (family friend) and he said "Why do you
need hot water for the washer?" We had our 1st baby on the way. We told his wife, they had a plumber out the next day.
Send your realtor,or his wife, a nice boquet of flowers... I'm sure you realize that he/she is not responsible for inspoection.... they are just very nice realtors and good helpfull friends....

We'd probably do the same... just ponting out the issue

Good luck with your most significant "new addition"

Best

Oh by the way from a man.... Do you really need hot water to a washing machine.
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Old 06-05-2013, 12:17 AM   #65
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Pendant and Can install; ran into problem need help


Yea, they are good friends, have known my wife's family a very long time. It wasn't real expensive, water heater and washer are both in the garage, they just did a surface run, took an hour. We included it in a list of incidentals we got reimbursed from the seller for. And yea, with a newborn you need hot water for the washer The "new addition" is going to be 7 next week and the kid count is 3 now, my gosh how time flies. And boy do 5 people generate a lot of laundry! I know, because I do most of it!

I have run into some other stuff that was not the home inspector's fault, but I wonder how passed inspection when being built.

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Old 06-05-2013, 06:58 AM   #66
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Should I just leave it be and not worry about it until it comes time to sell, or is it something worth doing now?
Many things get sold without being up to code. Yes, if it's inspected by someone that actually knows what they're doing then it'd be good to have it actually present. Otherwise it'd be a likely contingency request or a bidding factor.

But are you saying they put in the island and there's really no outlet on it, nor any wiring underneath? Or is there wire that someone didn't get it connected properly? It's just an island, without any plumbing or anything else in it?

With all your other troubles I figured it was at least worth checking that wires weren't actually run but left unconnected somehow.

And I take it there's no post or something else coming down from the ceiling to the island? Along which wiring could be run?
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Old 06-05-2013, 11:39 AM   #67
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Many things get sold without being up to code. Yes, if it's inspected by someone that actually knows what they're doing then it'd be good to have it actually present. Otherwise it'd be a likely contingency request or a bidding factor.

But are you saying they put in the island and there's really no outlet on it, nor any wiring underneath? Or is there wire that someone didn't get it connected properly? It's just an island, without any plumbing or anything else in it?

With all your other troubles I figured it was at least worth checking that wires weren't actually run but left unconnected somehow.

And I take it there's no post or something else coming down from the ceiling to the island? Along which wiring could be run?
It's just a fixed island with a cabinet and some shelving in the base. There's no power run to it period; not from the ceiling, not from under the floor. No plumbing. The counter top is single level, and it's a rectangle at 38x51. Based on the size I'm reading that (when I get around to doing it) I'm going to have to put in two receptacles?
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Old 06-05-2013, 01:04 PM   #68
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In an undivided island only one (1) outlet is required regardless of size
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Old 06-05-2013, 04:10 PM   #69
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Well, then you've heard the other observations. Find the 'least worst' place to run the conduit and rent the jackhammer...
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Old 06-05-2013, 06:50 PM   #70
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Well, then you've heard the other observations. Find the 'least worst' place to run the conduit and rent the jackhammer...
What I haven't been able to find yet is whether the slab needs to be filled afterward, or if I can just install the conduit and lay the new floorboard right over the area.

I assumed the channel would be less than an inch wide, so the floor would have plenty of slab to be sturdy. I assume.

I don't quite know if there's a sub-floor under the hardwood, or if the panels are just laid straight on the slab. If there is a plywood sub-floor I don't think there would be a need to fill in the channel, or am I wrong?
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Old 06-05-2013, 09:04 PM   #71
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What I haven't been able to find yet is whether the slab needs to be filled afterward, or if I can just install the conduit and lay the new floorboard right over the area.

I assumed the channel would be less than an inch wide, so the floor would have plenty of slab to be sturdy. I assume.

I don't quite know if there's a sub-floor under the hardwood, or if the panels are just laid straight on the slab. If there is a plywood sub-floor I don't think there would be a need to fill in the channel, or am I wrong?
Thread is now 5 pages and I may have missed it.... but what is your flooring, and any subflooring or subfloor framing structure. This is SOG (slabv on grade) is it not.

Pull a register vent (ie not SOG), or a transition strip, or cutout thru a hidden cabinet.... and determine what your floor structure is.

If it is SOG, after cutting/jacking for a conduit run,filling is nothing...$10.
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Old 06-05-2013, 09:33 PM   #72
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Thread is now 5 pages and I may have missed it.... but what is your flooring, and any subflooring or subfloor framing structure. This is SOG (slabv on grade) is it not.

Pull a register vent (ie not SOG), or a transition strip, or cutout thru a hidden cabinet.... and determine what your floor structure is.

If it is SOG, after cutting/jacking for a conduit run,filling is nothing...$10.
I took two pictures, one is the area behind the stove and under the adjacent cabinet. I can see the concrete slab and I can see that there's something between the floor boards and the slab.

The second picture shows the wall cabinet, and the edge of the island. That's the only area that will be visible and I'm thinking I will only need to rip up one board...?
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Old 06-05-2013, 09:47 PM   #73
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I took two pictures, one is the area behind the stove and under the adjacent cabinet. I can see the concrete slab and I can see that there's something between the floor boards and the slab.

The second picture shows the wall cabinet, and the edge of the island. That's the only area that will be visible and I'm thinking I will only need to rip up one board...?
Bob.... If I'm seeing this clearly, I think I'm looking at SOG with engineered flooring on a glue down. ANYONE ELSE SEE SOMETHING DIFFERENT PLEASE JUMP IN.... because I'm not certain from the picture.

This generally is not a complicated electrical issue, however it is a more complex flooring issue to be done with a good quality finish.

1) How important is that island electric to you???
2) Do you even have any replacement flooring???

Other quesions will follow, but these two are sorta NECESSARY conditiions before even considering to go forward.
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Old 06-05-2013, 10:05 PM   #74
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Sounds like you really want the outlet in the island
If you can get by with tearing up just one board, power on.
Cut the concrete with a concrete saw make it deep enough to cover with concrete, replace the wood floor.
Just be sure to patch the vaper barrier very well, wood floors don't like concrete w/o it. (atleast thats what I hear)
You might want to ask in the flooring area of this forum
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Old 06-05-2013, 10:47 PM   #75
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I don't want it in all that bad actually lol... I just like the learning process. I am just assuming that one day I'll have to tackle it though, whether we decide to rent or sell, so it would behoove of me to learn what I might be up against. Plus I'm never not in the mood to learn something new.

I do have a box of extra flooring.

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