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Old 06-20-2010, 08:55 PM   #1
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Hello everybody! I purchased this property over the winter, and with no experience with electrical work, I hired a friends dad to come butcher some wiring for me. What a nightmare, guy is a total moron and really did a horrible job. "Functionality wise its fine".
Holy crap....I would have gotten killed!
I need to fix this, can I still use the brand new cutler hammer main panel? It's a bit hacked up.

If I am running large equipment - welder, plasma cutter, air compressor...should I consider a certain panel and breakers over others?

I have this all removed from the wall now, and simply have the black wires sticking out of the wall. I am not using any of the existing conduit, I just want to get the box mounted, power on, and then wire the rest later.

I wanted to mount a main shutoff box, and then the main panel next to it. Is there specific ways I have to do this?

Any help will be very appreciated.

Here's a few pictures:



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Old 06-20-2010, 09:00 PM   #2
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Where are you located ? Local codes will apply

If the CH is new yes I would keep it
What size service, 100a...200a ?
Residential or Commercial property ?

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Old 06-20-2010, 09:02 PM   #3
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Alrighty now that you changed your name haha anyways I would go with a Square D box and Breakers obviously... um First thing I would do is fix the metal conduit... as for your main shutoff the things you need to remember are you need a shutoff the same size or larger as your service... honestly I don't understand why you would put a main shut off right next to the panel because a panel has a main breaker.... if you where looking for a main shutoff the only thing I could see is having it on the other side of the room encase of a injury/fire etc.... where you would need to kick the power off as fast as possible and running to the box is just way to far so you could shut it off on the other side... idk that's my thoughts on it
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Old 06-20-2010, 09:05 PM   #4
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Where are you located ? Local codes will apply

If the CH is new yes I would keep it
What size service, 100a...200a ?
Residential or Commercial property ?
I am located in the UP of Michigan.
The CH is new, but if I should buy something better and do it right I would have no problem doing so.
200 amp service
Not sure on the zoning, supposedly it was reverted back to residential after sitting vacant for a certain time period.
My zoning code reads "RG", and ECF neighborhood code is "15-Commercial - Retail"
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Old 06-20-2010, 09:09 PM   #5
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I don't understand why you would put a main shut off right next to the panel
I am going to be wiring this building in steps, possibly many steps. I'd like a solid shutoff so I have no chance of shoving my hands somewhere that they shouldn't belong if I am in the panel a lot. Those are my thoughts at least
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Old 06-20-2010, 09:50 PM   #6
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You will need to verify the zoning
Here you need a licensed electrician for commercial work
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Old 06-20-2010, 09:50 PM   #7
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I have this all removed from the wall now, and simply have the black wires sticking out of the wall. I am not using any of the existing conduit, I just want to get the box mounted, power on, and then wire the rest later.
Is this a main panel where the incoming wires are coming from the meter? If so, you must have the meter removed so it would be easy to replace the service wires. They are a little frayed and there is a splice in the neutral. Just a thought.
Also, that big hole where the service comes in isn't going to fly. That conduit has to be connected to the panel.

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Old 06-20-2010, 09:59 PM   #8
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Is this a main panel where the incoming wires are coming from the meter? If so, you must have the meter removed so it would be easy to replace the service wires. They are a little frayed and there is a splice in the neutral. Just a thought.
Also, that big hole where the service comes in isn't going to fly. That conduit has to be connected to the panel.

Ohh gotcha, the pipe has to be connected to the box. Can the box be patched and redrilled? Do the wires have to be replaced if they are fraying like that? Do the three wires coming in have to be crimped somewhere before entering the box? I believe somebody had mentioned needing the wires clamped off somewhere. Thanks!
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Old 06-21-2010, 01:23 AM   #9
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You allready just open up new cans of worms look like the EMT conduits it is not properly seceured at all and you no ground connections on the EMT conduits due they are floating around the hole that is pretty dangerous if the conduit get enerized for some reason.


What your freind done that work I will never leave that kind mess there there are few items it will need to be fixed before the electrical inspector will see that.

now you say you took it off from the wall if so you will have to remounted and I will stay with EMT conduit for sure otherwise if your code do allowed NM then you will have to pay attetion how to bond it to the metal juction boxes.

and are you going to rewire the whole place ? if so you will need proper permit.

Merci,Marc
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Old 06-21-2010, 02:51 PM   #10
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Ohh gotcha, the pipe has to be connected to the box. Can the box be patched and redrilled? Do the wires have to be replaced if they are fraying like that? Do the three wires coming in have to be crimped somewhere before entering the box? I believe somebody had mentioned needing the wires clamped off somewhere. Thanks!

Absolutely those main feed wires definately need to be re-ran those are looking quite bad... and the reason I say so is lets say you have a frayed insulation and the tip of your screwdriver hits that un insulated spot etc... let me tell you.... you will have one hell of a firework show and trust me I speak from doing it accidentally in the meter box haha.

Remember when you are redoing your service cables you need to have the meter pulled... if you are dead set like I was on pulling it myself than you need to at least make sure that you have the main breaker flipped on your panel so no power is being drawn... Also if you are dead set on replacing your own main lines make sure you are extremely careful and if using 4/0/0 aluminum to use a bit of the anti-oxidizing cream they make. As for that main that I had brought up why you where putting in I understand now where you are coming from ha ha trust me I wish I had a main shutoff the first time I was pulling my old fuse panel lol

As for the actual main wires being clamped down I don't beleive they have to be if they are completely in conduit... if you are using individual service entrance cables but if your using the aluminum like I said which is cheaper I know you need the clamp for the 4/0/0 size cable which you can find at any hardware or electrical supply that sells the cable.

Alright as for the conduit coming in that your main cables are ran through... that needs to be completely connected to your box... dont ask me why the hell the idiot you hired cut a hole in the box instead of using the punch-out... Im assuming because he didn't feel like changing out the board that is screwed into the brick... so instead he just makes his own hole... I can tell you this the man obviously was a idiot haha as for that being acceptable im not sure a electrician would need to tell you if you do move the box up to where that hole will connect to your punch-out and than you also make sure the box is completely secured and mounted if that is still legal having that hole even know it is flush with a board or the wall. I am just not exatly sure on code for that... I know any unused holes are suppose to be covered.


Edit:

Also please for dear god when you put back up a new box or that box PLEASE use screws instead of roofing nails that that idiot seemed to have used that didn't hold the box very well haha

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Old 06-22-2010, 10:32 AM   #11
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All I can say is holy isht. I hope you didn't pay him much.

Listen to what other people are saying. Getting electricuted is not fun at all. I speak from experience.
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:34 AM   #12
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I'm embarrassed for you!
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Old 06-22-2010, 01:09 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Subaru View Post
I am going to be wiring this building in steps, possibly many steps. I'd like a solid shutoff so I have no chance of shoving my hands somewhere that they shouldn't belong if I am in the panel a lot. Those are my thoughts at least
Here is my suggestion, think about aggressive use of sub-panels and Junction Boxes (j-boxes).

I would think about running a sub panel for the major zones of a house, like the Garage, Kitchen, office, entertaimnet room, and possibly bathrooms if you are going to really jazz them up. Sub-panels go anywhere you would like alot of custom or individualized circuits. You can power down the sub-panels from the main panel.

I would put at least one J-box near the service panel connected by a big fat conduit. Locate the J-box near where it is easiest to pull wires. You will run one set of wires from the break to the J-box, then wire nut this to whatever circuits you need. This gives you alot of flexibility for changing existing systems, you can power that one stupidly long circuit that was originally installed, while you break it down into smaller segments with new circuits.
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Old 06-22-2010, 01:30 PM   #14
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I'll be doing my new panel soon, but I'm lucky.... I can just go outside and cut the power at the pole. Po)

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Old 06-23-2010, 12:35 AM   #15
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The main thing I want to do is get the box mounted to the wall safely and within code. Right now there is no box on the wall, just the three wires sticking out of the wall. From there I know people locally that can help me wire all kinds of stuff, so I was hoping somebody could tell me exactly what I need to mount the box on the wall and have the service turned on. Thanks!

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