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Old 07-20-2014, 07:51 PM   #31
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Outdoor electric project - rough in help please


Quote:
Originally Posted by rjniles
NM into the back of a WP box is done all the time. I have never heard of an inspector question it. Millions of AC disconnects are wire that way.
But article 440 does not specifically state that romex is only permitted inside the dwelling unit. As for an inspector questioning it, you've never worked in New Jersey.

Where is the op from?

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Old 07-20-2014, 07:52 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by OhmZoned
I got all of my SCH40 PVC conduit run and glued together, now I am going to pull through my wires. I just want to confirm - am I allowed to have 2 separate circuits run into a double gang 4x4 box? From here each circuit will connect to a GFCI outlet and then from the load side, I am going to run 12G THWN out to the post in the yard where each circuit will terminate in a single gang outlet. Are you allowed to have 2 separate circuits power 2 separate outlets in the same box? Or should I just use this 4x4 box as a junction box and skip the outlets? I did like the outlet idea. Thanks!
Is that connector listed for two cables. Is this a storable pool?
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Old 07-20-2014, 08:18 PM   #33
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Outdoor electric project - rough in help please


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Originally Posted by IslandGuy View Post
Be careful where you locate the convenience receptacle. If memory serves, it has to be within 20' of, but not closer than 10' to the pool.
was once upon a time.

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Old 07-21-2014, 10:19 AM   #34
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Outdoor electric project - rough in help please


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Originally Posted by ritelec View Post
connector in the box. shabby.
Sadly, I agree with you. I did that so the metal box would sit flush with the house. I was able to get all of the wires and the outlets into the box, but I feel like it was a tight fit. If I were to redo it I was thinking of cutting a bigger hole in the house (maybe 1.5") and then putting the connector on the back of the box and sealing it all up with duct seal. It would require re-wiring everything in the box, but I kind of agree... shabby. Just didn't want to cut a huge hole into the house. Would you redo it?





Quote:
Originally Posted by IslandGuy View Post
Be careful where you locate the convenience receptacle. If memory serves, it has to be within 20' of, but not closer than 10' to the pool.
If I look at 2011 NEC [680.22(A)(3)] it states"At least one 15A or 20A, 125V receptacle is required to be located between 6 ft and 20 ft from the inside walls of a permanently installed pool at a dwelling unit with a maximum height of not more than 6 ft above the grade or floor." The outlet I have on the post is about 7' from the pool. Also, the outlet along the back of the house should fall within the 10'-20' range as well. I think I am ok, but I cannot find any updates to the NEC for this section.

Quote:
Originally Posted by electures View Post
But article 440 does not specifically state that romex is only permitted inside the dwelling unit. As for an inspector questioning it, you've never worked in New Jersey. Where is the op from?
I am from Pennsylvania, just outside of Philadelphia. If I am going to have to redo the box, should I not put NM into the back of it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by electures View Post
Is that connector listed for two cables. Is this a storable pool?
The connector is a 3/4" NM clamp connector. I do not know if it is rated for two cables, I thought I read that you could do two. My box only has 1 opening on the back. This is a standard clamp connector - can I use two NM cables? Or do I have to split it up? Sounds like I may need a different box. Open to suggestions.

Is this a storable pool - wellllll, kind of. According to the NEC, it is not since it is 48" deep. They consider anything over 42" storable. However, the pool IS storable and it does get taken down every year. The filter also does not have a twist lock type plug. Just a standard 3 prong plug.
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Old 07-22-2014, 12:01 PM   #35
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Outdoor electric project - rough in help please


Quote:
Originally Posted by OhmZoned
Sadly, I agree with you. I did that so the metal box would sit flush with the house. I was able to get all of the wires and the outlets into the box, but I feel like it was a tight fit. If I were to redo it I was thinking of cutting a bigger hole in the house (maybe 1.5") and then putting the connector on the back of the box and sealing it all up with duct seal. It would require re-wiring everything in the box, but I kind of agree... shabby. Just didn't want to cut a huge hole into the house. Would you redo it? If I look at 2011 NEC [680.22(A)(3)] it states"At least one 15A or 20A, 125V receptacle is required to be located between 6 ft and 20 ft from the inside walls of a permanently installed pool at a dwelling unit with a maximum height of not more than 6 ft above the grade or floor." The outlet I have on the post is about 7' from the pool. Also, the outlet along the back of the house should fall within the 10'-20' range as well. I think I am ok, but I cannot find any updates to the NEC for this section. I am from Pennsylvania, just outside of Philadelphia. If I am going to have to redo the box, should I not put NM into the back of it? The connector is a 3/4" NM clamp connector. I do not know if it is rated for two cables, I thought I read that you could do two. My box only has 1 opening on the back. This is a standard clamp connector - can I use two NM cables? Or do I have to split it up? Sounds like I may need a different box. Open to suggestions. Is this a storable pool - wellllll, kind of. According to the NEC, it is not since it is 48" deep. They consider anything over 42" storable. However, the pool IS storable and it does get taken down every year. The filter also does not have a twist lock type plug. Just a standard 3 prong plug.
I doubt very much the 3/4 connector is listed for two cables. Furthermore, when connectors are installed inside the box as you have done the conductors are folded/pinched against the connector. This is a possible short circuit. Cut the bigger hole and install a short section of PVC conduit into the dwelling. Put another box and transmission to THHN/THWN conductors.
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Old 07-22-2014, 12:36 PM   #36
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Outdoor electric project - rough in help please


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Originally Posted by electures View Post
Cut the bigger hole and install a short section of PVC conduit into the dwelling. Put another box and transmission to THHN/THWN conductors.
Got it - thank you for calling out where I can improve my work. I am going for correct, not shabby. I should have done it this way the first time.

I was hesitant to cut a bigger hole in the house, but I suppose that is what they make duct seal and caulk for. Also, now that I only have to run the PVC conduit and not get the clamp into a hole, it should only be a 1-1/8" hole, not too bad.

Amazing what experience teaches...

Thanks again, back to the crawlspace...
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Old 07-22-2014, 02:50 PM   #37
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Outdoor electric project - rough in help please


Also connect all the grounds as one.
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Old 07-23-2014, 12:29 PM   #38
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Inside, what type of connector should I use for the PVC to the metal junction box? Do I use the threaded male adapter (top one) or do I use the other type that just gets cemented to the PVC (bottom one)?

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Old 07-23-2014, 12:35 PM   #39
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Threaded.
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Old 07-23-2014, 12:39 PM   #40
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Threaded.
Sorry one more question: Do I need to have some type of a locking washer inside, or do I just twist the threaded fitting into the hole and make sure it is secure?

I could not find the washers to lock it at Home Depot, but that may be Home Depot, not me.
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Old 07-23-2014, 12:43 PM   #41
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Lock nuts.
You should find them where ever the metal conduit and connectors are located.
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Old 07-25-2014, 12:01 PM   #42
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I think I am done! I added a junction box in the crawlspace where I transitioned from NM to THWN. I know it looks like all of the wires are twisted together in this photo, but I can assure you that it is only the grounds that are tied together with the wire nut and then pigtail connected to the metal box.





I ran PVC conduit to the back of the box outside and got rid of my shabby work and that clamp inside. Made for much more room when tucking the wires back in. I also figured that since I have 2 circuits in the same box, I would put electrical tape along the side/contacts for the outlets. This way in case anything moved over time, it would not cause a short.



Got two green lights and the GFCI test works properly...


Thanks to everyone for your help and suggestions.
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Old 07-25-2014, 12:31 PM   #43
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Looks good.
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Old 08-20-2014, 11:35 AM   #44
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Thanks again to everyone who helped me out on this project. The electrical inspector was here the other day and I PASSED!!! He actually commented that I did a nice job on the work, which was nice to hear.

Many, many thanks to everyone. On to the next project.... never ends.

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Old 08-20-2014, 01:20 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Msradell View Post
Why not go one step further and put the 2 GFCI receptacles in a double box on the outside of the house? That way he would gain 2 additional outside receptacles and could use the same box to make this splice between NM and TWHN for the underground run.
Note that they must now be the ' weather resistant type ' ....

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