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Old 12-12-2009, 10:21 AM   #31
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Older air compressor wiring help


So is it acceptable to use a 120v switch if I use the ground?

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Old 12-12-2009, 10:28 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lash-1295 View Post
So is it acceptable to use a 120v switch if I use the ground?
??????????????


I hope you do not mean "use the ground in place of a neutral so as to have 120 volts" Because if it is, the answer is emphatic "NO".

You need to be using the ground for it's intended purpose anyway. You cannot use the ground as a neutral. You need to bring a proper neutral to the controller to allow the use of a 120 volt coil and control circuit.
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Old 12-12-2009, 11:48 AM   #33
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Like nap stated, the ground cannot be used to carry current. Not even a little bit.

If you use a starter with a 120 volt coil, you'll need a total of 4 wires from the panel to the starter. Two hots, a neutral, and a ground.

If you use a starter with a 240 volt coil, you'll need a total of 3 wires from the panel to the starter. Two hots, and a ground.

The only other options are to replace the 120 volt coil with a 240 volt one, or install a control power transformer. This transformer needs to be designed for motor controls, a regular transformer will work only if it's grossly oversized.

Rob

P.S. A 240 volt coil for a typical size 1 starter will cost about $80-100, a control transformer will cost about $70, but you'll need to mount it in some sort of box. A 6"X6"X6" will work. Ebay will be less.
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Old 12-12-2009, 12:29 PM   #34
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http://www.weg.net/files/products/WE...re-english.pdf

Here is an example of a single phase fully assembled starter for around $100.00. Nema 1 enclosure, 5 HP rated contactor rated @240 VAC, user must select OLR and coil voltage, and prewired with wiring instructions. The OP could use the pressure switch in lieu of the rocker or push button start/stop. However, a disconnect may be required?

You guys did all the research, I just thought I might be able to help with the starter selection and give the OP an idea of what he should be looking for.

Last edited by J. V.; 12-12-2009 at 12:38 PM.
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Old 12-12-2009, 12:35 PM   #35
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Older air compressor wiring help


Guess that did not sound too good the way I wrote it. LOL.
Thanks for the clarification.
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Old 12-12-2009, 12:50 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J. V. View Post
http://www.weg.net/files/products/WE...re-english.pdf

Here is an example of a single phase fully assembled starter for around $100.00. Nema 1 enclosure, 5 HP rated contactor rated @240 VAC, user must select OLR and coil voltage, and prewired with wiring instructions. The OP could use the pressure switch in lieu of the rocker or push button start/stop. However, a disconnect may be required?

You guys did all the research, I just thought I might be able to help with the starter selection and give the OP an idea of what he should be looking for.
actually the pressure switch would not be used in lieu of the start/stop. The P/S would need to be wired inline properly so it would shut down the compressor but not drop out the run circuit so the comp would restart automatically when pressure drops. The stop would drop out the run circuit totally.

the oil pressure switch could be hooked in either way since it must be reset to restart the machine but I would still wire it in to totally shut down the run circuit.

Last edited by nap; 12-12-2009 at 12:52 PM.
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Old 12-12-2009, 01:27 PM   #37
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The starter from the site that J.V. provided would be #ESWS-25V24E-RM33. If you want an on-off switch, get the field kit modification # KESWFP. It's easy to wire, if the instructions are unclear, there's about 10 of us around here who can walk you through it.

The overload in this starter is an IEC type, it doesn't use heaters. It has a dial that you set with a screwdriver to the full-load current of the motor. Yours is 18 amps.

The only slight drawback to this starter is it has class 10 overloads. These are sort of fast-acting. If the compressor comes up to speed in less than 5 seconds (it very likely does), it'll be OK. If it takes longer, the overloads might trip unnecessarily.

Rob
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Old 12-13-2009, 11:37 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nap View Post
actually the pressure switch would not be used in lieu of the start/stop. The P/S would need to be wired inline properly so it would shut down the compressor but not drop out the run circuit so the comp would restart automatically when pressure drops. The stop would drop out the run circuit totally.

the oil pressure switch could be hooked in either way since it must be reset to restart the machine but I would still wire it in to totally shut down the run circuit.
Why not? The pressure switch can and will control the starter without any operator interface (start/stop). You want the pressure switch to drop out the contactor. The OPS would be wired in series with the pressure switch.

There is no requirement for a start/stop button or switch. Maybe a disconnect, but not a start/stop.
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Old 12-13-2009, 09:40 PM   #39
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See next

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Old 12-13-2009, 10:03 PM   #40
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http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-Siemens-Sing...item4ce5b68cfe

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...=STRK:MEWAX:IT

Would one of these work if I have them put in the proper size heaters?
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Old 12-13-2009, 10:50 PM   #41
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lash 1295 (Poster #7) Look for Motor ratings; Voltage, FLA & LRA (Probably the one item NAP skipped?) Ph. Single or 3ph. Size of motor/RPM. inside the Humongous cover.
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Old 12-13-2009, 10:54 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J. V. View Post
Why not? The pressure switch can and will control the starter without any operator interface (start/stop). You want the pressure switch to drop out the contactor. The OPS would be wired in series with the pressure switch.

There is no requirement for a start/stop button or switch. Maybe a disconnect, but not a start/stop.
But most (quality) magnetic starters I've seen come with START/STOP buttons. Except they have to be wired properly. And what if not. That's a story for another thread.
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Old 12-14-2009, 12:06 AM   #43
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a motor starter only comes with a stop start button if that is how you order it. There are many times where I have a motor starter and the stop start station is nowhere near the motor starter so having one on the starter is an unnecessary expense.

A lot of times, there will be an on/off/auto selector on a motor starter as well but again, only if it is needed or wanted.

when operating motors with other controls, having a stop start on the starter is not the norm.
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Old 12-14-2009, 12:14 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J. V. View Post
Why not? The pressure switch can and will control the starter without any operator interface (start/stop). You want the pressure switch to drop out the contactor. The OPS would be wired in series with the pressure switch.

There is no requirement for a start/stop button or switch. Maybe a disconnect, but not a start/stop.
You wire it how you want to wire it and I wire it how I like. If you put the air pressure switch in the wrong place, it will drop out the coil and you would need to hit the start button to restart the machine. That is where I would put the oil pressure switch so I would have to restart the machine manually for the loss of oil pressure since that is something the operator should attend to.

with the air pressure, you would want the compressor to cycle on and off as needed. Like I said, if you put that in the wrong place in the circuit, it will not do that.

as to requirement for on/off. How do you propose turning it on and off?


I do not like to use breakers for switches. I would not plug this in so that means I would put an on/off switch on the thing.

a disconnect may or may not be required but that would depend on where the breaker is from the compressor. If you need a disco, I would use a combination starter/disco.
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Old 12-14-2009, 01:33 AM   #45
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Either of those starters will work just fine. Easy to install and connect, and with the proper heater, it'll protect the motor.

If you want an on-off switch, a basic light switch will work. Mount it in a single-gang handy box (1-7/8" or 2-1/8" deep). If you'd like, the handy box can be mounted directly to the starter box using a 1/2" chase nipple and a locknut, and a couple of 8/32 X 1/2" machine screws.

Just wire the switch in series with the rest of the control circuit. If you need help with the controls, any one of about a dozen of us around here can walk you through it.

Rob

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