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-   -   new 240 oulet...need troubleshooting help (http://www.diychatroom.com/f18/new-240-oulet-need-troubleshooting-help-78855/)

alfaman 08-15-2010 09:57 PM

new 240 oulet...need troubleshooting help
 
hi...have a new 240 three prong 50 amp outlet (for lincoln a/c d/c welder)
wired from a 100 amp subpanel in my garage...

here's my problem...the welder won't work.....when i test the outlet, i get
120v in each leg, but nothing (no 240 v) when i try to multimeter the two hot legs together (i plug the welder in most of the way and then multitested the hot prongs)...multimeter reads "0" and a "-" (looks like a minus sign flashes)

i'm sure the subpanel is wired correctedly....ground and white are seperate in the sub...i have a double poll 40 amp breaker (one power switch) in the sub

i have two hots and a bare ground running from the subpanel to the outlet....i also have a white..unconnected to anything (just pulled it from the sub to the outlet just in case)....please note, my lincoln welder takes a three prong outlet...not the four...so i didn't use the white ..

gauge wire from the main to the house is 4....the gauge of wire from
subpanel to outlet is 6 (except 12 for bare ground)

sorry if this sounds confusing, but i am consused!

Jim Port 08-15-2010 10:05 PM

Is this powered by a two pole breaker or a tandem breaker?

A tandem breaker only supplies 120 volt power to two circuits, not 240 to one circuit.

alfaman 08-15-2010 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Port (Post 486295)
Is this powered by a two pole breaker or a tandem breaker?

A tandem breaker only supplies 120 volt power to two circuits, not 140 to one circuit.

double pole..just like this one...thanks for the response

GE Model # THQL2140

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/...02&marketID=48

Proby 08-15-2010 10:22 PM

Measure the two termination points of the breaker and see what you are getting.

Check all connections. It is possible that one of the hots is loose and you are reading phantom voltage when metering it to ground.

alfaman 08-15-2010 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Proby (Post 486307)
Measure the two termination points of the breaker and see what you are getting.

Check all connections. It is possible that one of the hots is loose and you are reading phantom voltage when metering it to ground.

are the termination points where the wire is connected to the breaker?

by the way...when i use a voltage detector, both the outlet and the wire from the welder (when plugged in)
suggests there is voltage/hot...by the way, i'm sure the welder works..i tested it in another outlet

Proby 08-15-2010 10:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alfaman (Post 486310)
are the termination points where the wire is connected to the breaker?

Yes.
Quote:

by the way...when i use a voltage detector, both the outlet and the wire from the welder (when plugged in)
suggests there is voltage/hot...
We know there is one hot, we are trying to figure out why the other one isn't working.
Quote:

by the way, i'm sure the welder works..i tested it in another outlet
The welder isn't the problem, the leg that is reading 120V to ground but 0 to the other leg is the problem.

alfaman 08-15-2010 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Proby (Post 486322)
Yes.
We know there is one hot, we are trying to figure out why the other one isn't working.

The welder isn't the problem, the leg that is reading 120V to ground but 0 to the other leg is the problem.

thanks prody.....i hope i explained it correctly....each hot side is reading 120 v when grounded....but can't get 240v between them.....hope i'm not being redundant...thanks for your time and help in trying to help me figure this out....have an old alfa my father and i are trying to restore

Proby 08-15-2010 11:23 PM

So you are saying that you measured the two terminals of the 2-pole breaker and you do not get 240V between them?

If that is true, then you have to check the sub panel. Whatever it is fed with, either by main lug or main breaker, you have to check this and see if you get 240V between the two.

Red Squirrel 08-15-2010 11:43 PM

I know with my panel, I can't just put a double pole breaker anywhere in it. They legs are not staggered at every circuit. If you get 0 volts from both screws, test from one screw to the breaker below or above, to see if you get 240. If you do, you'll want to move it up or down a notch.

alfaman 08-15-2010 11:52 PM

thanks..i'll check first thing tomorrow



it's a ge subpanel box...forgot the model, but labeled subpanel with
100 amp breaker and a few 20 amps in it

alfaman 08-15-2010 11:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alfaman (Post 486356)
thanks..i'll check first thing tomorrow



it's a ge subpanel box...forgot the model, but labeled subpanel with
100 amp breaker and a few 20 amps in it


just found the model #

GE DEH-40537

hopefully i can put double breakers in it

alfaman 08-16-2010 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Proby (Post 486343)
So you are saying that you measured the two terminals of the 2-pole breaker and you do not get 240V between them?

If that is true, then you have to check the sub panel. Whatever it is fed with, either by main lug or main breaker, you have to check this and see if you get 240V between the two.


ok..will do...just ran out in the dark and thought the mail lugs also read zero with the "-"...but just a quick check..i'll be more exact tomorrow

by the way..the three 20 amps circuits in my garage work fine from this subpanel

alfaman 08-16-2010 12:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Proby (Post 486343)
So you are saying that you measured the two terminals of the 2-pole breaker and you do not get 240V between them?

If that is true, then you have to check the sub panel. Whatever it is fed with, either by main lug or main breaker, you have to check this and see if you get 240V between the two.


when using a multimeter:

to check the box...or breaker in the box...do i place the hot on the breaker or lug and the black on a ground?..

Jim Port 08-16-2010 01:04 AM

It does not matter which lead is placed on the hot or ground.

jbfan 08-16-2010 07:43 AM

Check the placement of the breaker.
Ge panels are made so the whole panel with accept the thin breakers, and sometime you can put a thin 2 pole breaker into a single pole slot.


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