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Old 11-07-2007, 01:21 PM   #76
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Stubbie .,, i understand what you are saying on this mess on the spa and right now i am more inclinded to agree with you with the service pack after i was reading the wiring digram to see how it lay out.

Let me guess for a min [ this is not a answer yet ] but what if someone did replace the spa control panel before and gave this tub to Honker.,,

if that the case it will compound the issue to some degree with it.

right now if Honker is reading this my suggest is stop everything before it really screw up everything.

i know it may confuse some of us whom been keep tracking on this sistuation here and yes i do understand there is a code volation there but we will deal with that in a moment.

Honker,.. if you are reading this now my best suggest is either get a electricican or get a good freind whom know the electrical system because next part i dont know you will be conftable with this or not because it may be confusing on this part.
Let us know what you will plan to do next.

sorry about that but i feel it will be much wiser just stop for now and see where we stand so we can sort out the mess


Merci , Marc

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Old 11-07-2007, 02:20 PM   #77
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Marc

These are all things that concern me, you know well that experience goes a long way with these spas.

We haven't even been able to verify electrical specifications as yet other than she has a 40 amp gfci serving the spa. All of these Brett Aqualine 240 volt are 50 amp that I've been able to find. I think I saw one for 30 amp maybe the one I posted not sure. Small issue but it would be nice to know what we have with Honkers spa.

Andy could be right this maybe as simple as a new beaker I just don't think I will ever be confident in saying throw in a new gfci and climb in the thing.

My feeling is that a hot tub like this situation needs to be evaluated at todays code standards. It would have to be pretty freakin old not to need an outside maintenance disconnect. There was a post where she mentioned a slew of wirenuts and that worries me some also...maybe normal or a spa pack change out or parts change out as you mentioned somewhere in the past.

I would not power the thing with out gfci in order to test the operation... frankly that ain't a good idea. At least I would not have Honker do it that way.

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Old 11-07-2007, 05:09 PM   #78
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You're right Stub, And I would never suggest anyone on this site power this thing without GFCI protection... What I said is what I would do if I was being paid alot of money to troubleshoot this thing.

I take that back... Since she's a girl I'd upsell her on the power pack (which I've always said could be the issue) and then I'd really upsell her on a panel change out as well as a service upgrade using the bad breaker as a selling point....$5600-6500 easy in ATL.

Actually, I'd do none of that.. I'd diagnose the problem and fix it for a fair profit which allows me to make a very comfortable living. It is an old spa and probably does need a new power pack. She should probably go ahead and order one. I'm guessin the mess of wirenuts is where the recp was added on after the fact. As far as whether anybody can safely work in their own homes... that is not for me to decide. But the fact is, this is a DIY site and all I can do is stress safety. Which I've done. Is Honker smart enough to figure this out based on our advice??? I'd like to think so. I assure you that people less intelligent work on their homes everyday.


Or you could just hire an electrician and be done with it. Get three quotes. Be more than willing to PAY for these quotes.($25-50) THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A FREE ESTIMATE. Post back.

Andy in Atlanta, GA
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Old 11-07-2007, 06:10 PM   #79
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Hey Andy

I think you have done fine (just wish you were her neighbor...) If her tests were correct then you are correct the gfci is bad. Might be all there is to it. Got a feeling it goes deeper than what we see from our vantage point.

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Old 11-07-2007, 08:00 PM   #80
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Honker,

I personally work 45-60 hrs/wk. I think that even though your job as a (strikingly beautiful) TV anchorperson is probably very demanding (probably being interviewed to go national...CNN? Fox? MSNBC?) you should tighten up, take a few days, and resolve this thing. There are hundreds of DIYer's worldwide who are viewing this sucker like a soap opera and are dying to see it resolved. Fill the tub with ******* dirt and plant pansies in it for the winter.

I'm joking...Take your time and ANALYZE. Confidence is still high. We all have nothing but time...But if you leave us hanging no matter the outcome, millions will be crushed(me anyways).

Your pal, Andy
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Old 11-07-2007, 08:09 PM   #81
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Careful Andy I live only a few hours from Honker I may go get your cookies for you.

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Old 11-07-2007, 08:19 PM   #82
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Cookies--smookies...Go fix that tub and i'll shoot you a check for half the gas you burn.
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Old 11-07-2007, 08:24 PM   #83
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Ya guys i wondering what if Honker get the camera and take the picture and put in some kind of website and upload it or run a link so we can see more clearer what is going on.

a photo will worth a thousand words.

Merci,Marc
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Old 11-07-2007, 08:37 PM   #84
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Marc

She just moved in not to long ago and can't find the camera in all the boxes.
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Old 11-11-2007, 03:03 PM   #85
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Me, again. Sorry for the delay...

Andy, "my pal", in post 56 you said if it was wired right it should have #8AWG. Well, upon close inspection (awfully light print) I've discovered the wire is 6, not 8. And Stubbie appears to be right about it needing to be 50 amp. I've carefully considered everyone's advice, and want to emphasize that safety definitely needs to come first. As for myself, so far I'm still comfortable with what I've done and want to continue, if you're still willing to help. Taking all of this into consideration, is it as easy as buying a 50 amp GFCI and giving that a try? (#6 is the correct wire size for it, yes? Geez, they're spendy...) Or do I need to know something else? I sure don't mean to drag this out, but I can only go as fast as other projects and the cash on hand permits. Thanks, and please reply back...
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Old 11-11-2007, 03:21 PM   #86
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Why hell no, we aren't gonna help! we are all pissed now !

Just kidding You are correct, #6 is for 50A. Reread all posts carefully. Especially the stuff Stubbie posted about the High limit switch.

You were interviewing with the Fox News Channel, weren't ya?

Edit to add: #64 and #79 are pertinent. Although I'm not convinced you have tub problems, I just don't know. Stubbie and French think you do, and that is good enough for me. Moving into a new place is fun, ain't it?

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Old 11-11-2007, 03:53 PM   #87
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Hi Honker

The wire size doesn't really tell us if it is a 50 amp requirement for the hot tub. I'm also not 100 percent sure if the gfci is actually bad though it does sound like it is. I am torn between telling you that for your own safety you should have a professional look at this and telling you to get a new gfci and see if that works.
I am also concerned that the high limit is tripped out on the heater pack which creates more problems.
I am also concerned on the age of the tub and its over all condition...ie... is it all rusted in the control compartment and in bad shape over all.

Current code requires that you have a disconnect out by the tub... this really isn't an emergency disconnect but none the less it makes things a heck of a lot safer IMO. Especially for anyone messing with the guts of the pool like changing the heater.

I'm not going to raise cane with anyone else that wants to help you continue but I'm just not comfortable having you go on with this..your pretty handy but it is making me too uneasy. No offense intended.

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Old 11-11-2007, 04:01 PM   #88
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Ahh, yes... I forgot to include my thoughts on that one. (trying to phrase this so I don't sound way too girl...) In the very beginning, way back when I didn't know much about this stuff, I guess I just assumed that since the breaker wouldn't come on that the hot tub would need to be reset. In having a conversation with someone about it I mentioned that the reset didn't appear to be working because I couldn't push it in. I could grab it and pull it out slightly, no tension in it, but I couldn't push it in to reset it. The guy looks at me like I'm a dumba** and says, "Well, that's 'cuz it's not triggered. You won't be able to push it in unless it needs to be reset." And if it's the breaker that's bad, and not the hot tub, that seemed to make sense to me. Are you politely trying to tell me to hand this off? If so, I'll do that, no offense taken on my end. But - well, I better just stop there and wait for your next witty response.

And Fox turned me down, said I had too strong of a resemblance to my Uncle Butch.
Still want to help???
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Old 11-11-2007, 04:12 PM   #89
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Hey there, Stub...

I was writing back to Andy and saw your post after I posted mine. While it appears to be an older model, everything looks to be in near mint condition under the skirting. I see zero rust anywhere, and the "maze of wires and the little screw caps" that I was talking about make a lot more sense now that I'm knowing more about what I'm looking at. I've been doing a little research on the subject outside this site to gain some extra knowledge in the field, but don't worry, I'm not getting over-confident in my abilities at this point. Everything under there, including hoses, wires, all of it, has been kept very clean and free from outside-the-skirting influence. (is that a proper term?)
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Old 11-11-2007, 04:30 PM   #90
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Honkabutchytonk,

The disconnect mentioned in post # 64 solves some problems. It eleminates the need for a $100 GFCI breaker for the panel and drops you down to $10 or so for A regular 2-pole breaker. It also makes it wicked easier to install that romantic mood lighting (you never responded to my Barry White postit was my personal favourite).

On the other hand, if you installed a spendy 50A GFCI breaker, you might be done. As in no more worries. Stubbies big worry is you are going to install the breaker, there is a big fault in the tub, and you get hurt. I just haven't been provided evidence that this is going to happen. IN MY EXPERIENCE, one fault is the problem on this kind of service call. I COULD BE WRONG. That is that 5% chance we were talking about. Hell, weeks ago, when this whole thing started I said I didn't think it was gonna be the breaker. Because the odds were that it wasn't going to be.

This is a DIY site Honk (if that is your real name ) My confidence is still high. It is up to you, though. Is it cold there, Honk?

I have been called " outside the skirting influence" before, and I was just in High School.

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Last edited by Andy in ATL; 11-11-2007 at 04:32 PM.
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