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Old 11-29-2011, 07:37 AM   #16
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Multiple Grounding Rods


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Originally Posted by hayashi View Post
I am no electrician but since my kids might use this outlet I decided to find and read the code. I read it on the internet so it must be true, right?

[406.3(D)(3)]

A. Where no equipment bonding means exists in the outlet box, nongrounding-type receptacles can be replaced with :

Another nongrounding-type receptacle.
A GFCI grounding-type receptacle marked "No Equipment Ground."
A grounding-type receptacle, if GFCI protected and marked "GFCI Protected" and "No Equipment Ground."
Note: GFCI protection functions properly on a 2-wire circuit without an equipment grounding (bonding) conductor, because the equipment grounding (bonding) conductor serves no role in the operation of the GFCI-protection device.

So I won't be plugging the hole but I will be labeling it.
Yes, but your installation does not meet code because it is not a replacement, it is a new receptacle.

Sorry.

Mark

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Old 11-29-2011, 10:42 AM   #17
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Multiple Grounding Rods


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Yes, but your installation does not meet code because it is not a replacement, it is a new receptacle.

Sorry.

Mark
LOL. Well, its not new anymore cause its done. Thanks all.
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Old 11-29-2011, 11:55 AM   #18
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Multiple Grounding Rods


Excellent. Now we know the whole story. Thanks.
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Old 11-29-2011, 01:26 PM   #19
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Multiple Grounding Rods


Well, you can lie to yourself and believe you've met code, but unless you used a nonmetallic box and cover for your new installation, you have more than just the one code violation and a very unsafe installation. The GFCI does nothing to keep the box or cover from being energized by the incoming wires. Only proper grounding would do that.

Mark
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Old 11-29-2011, 03:36 PM   #20
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Multiple Grounding Rods


I would not be comfortable with this installation on my property. This is not the same circumstance as replacing a normal ungrounded receptacle with a GFCI. There is absolutely no protection to prevent the metal pole itself from becoming energized. That is an extremely dangerous condition to have, because any person or animal walking on the ground near the pole can be electrocuted without even touching it (google "step potential"). Touching the pole or even walking near it could be fatal. All it takes is a loose connection, worn insulation, or water in the fixture, and the whole thing will be hot. The only safe solution to this (aside from running new wire) is to use a GFCI circuit breaker, or feed the circuit from the load side of a GFCI back at the house. If I were you, I'd change it. This is a dangerous condition.
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Old 11-29-2011, 10:23 PM   #21
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Multiple Grounding Rods


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Originally Posted by busman View Post
Well, you can lie to yourself and believe you've met code, but unless you used a nonmetallic box and cover for your new installation, you have more than just the one code violation and a very unsafe installation. The GFCI does nothing to keep the box or cover from being energized by the incoming wires. Only proper grounding would do that.

Mark
Hey busman, I lie to myself every day when I tell myself I am rich and good looking. I do want to be safe and if you have some installation advice I'd love to hear it -- its better and more productive that just hearing that I am lying to myself. Up to now, I've taken the advice from this thread in this install. I'm not adverse to hearing what I am doing wrong as long as there's a bit of how to do it right.
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Old 11-29-2011, 10:28 PM   #22
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Multiple Grounding Rods


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Originally Posted by mpoulton View Post
I would not be comfortable with this installation on my property. This is not the same circumstance as replacing a normal ungrounded receptacle with a GFCI. There is absolutely no protection to prevent the metal pole itself from becoming energized. That is an extremely dangerous condition to have, because any person or animal walking on the ground near the pole can be electrocuted without even touching it (google "step potential"). Touching the pole or even walking near it could be fatal. All it takes is a loose connection, worn insulation, or water in the fixture, and the whole thing will be hot. The only safe solution to this (aside from running new wire) is to use a GFCI circuit breaker, or feed the circuit from the load side of a GFCI back at the house. If I were you, I'd change it. This is a dangerous condition.
What are your referring to with the "metal pole"? The conduit? The poles of the outlet itself?
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Old 11-30-2011, 02:54 AM   #23
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Multiple Grounding Rods


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What are your referring to with the "metal pole"? The conduit? The poles of the outlet itself?
I assumed the light was on a pole of some kind. If not, then my same comments apply with respect to the case of the light fixture. Whatever.

Now you mention conduit, though. That could change EVERYTHING. Is the circuit piped all the way back to the panel in metal conduit? If so, then it IS grounded/bonded - the conduit itself is the grounding conductor. You just need to properly connect the receptacle's grounding terminal to the conduit.

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