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Old 02-21-2012, 07:43 PM   #1
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I am about to "gut" 2 rooms in my home. One is a guest room, the other is going to become a nursery room. As a future first time "Dad", I am prepping for the future.

First off, this house was built in 2005, and I have never seen such crappy construction! As I have found out, there is a great story behind that, but probably not appropriate for this forum. To be clear, I knew what I was getting when I bought the house!

So, it has been determined that I will be allowed to gut these two rooms. The guest room is roughly 12 by 9. Fits a Queen bed nicely, with room at end of bed to walk between it, and the dresser.

The office/nursery shares the wall that the dresser is against in the guest room, and it's roughly 10 X 11.

As I have been doing work in the home, I have discovered and repaired many "sins", and with the help of my local building inspector, have been fixing the issues as I find them.

With that in mind, I am looking for some thoughts and ideas for what I can do with the room. So, if you had a blank slate, what would you do, specifically in the guest room. I will come back to the nursery shortly.

Ideas:

1) Turn lights on/off from entry, and both sides of bed
2) 10 Outlet with selected uper half of outlets switched
3) Recessed lights for general lighting in room
4) 2 3" gimbal lights accenting 2 pieces of artwork in the room
5) Independent fan (No light kit) control from entry and both sides of bed
6) Independent switched reading lights on each side of bed
7) ???

Yes, I do not believe you can have too much light, or too many outlets. Lights can always be dimmed, and nobody says you have to use every outlet, in fact, many will likely be unused. I would rather have installed them and not need them, than need them, having NOT installed them. Make sense?

Right now, in my current dream about this room, I have 4 switches on the wall as I enter the room;

1) Switched outlets
2) Recessed lights (Dimmer)
3) Accent (Dimmer)
4) Fan (3-way)

So, dream out loud if you will, I had planned on pulling four 15 amp circuits. Also, I have not thought much about the nursery simply because I have never needed one! So, what do you wish you had in a nursery?

Thanks for your time, and I DO know my way around electric, lots of experience, but no formal training. NEC, my building inspector, and google are some great friends of mine.

Oh, I will get a rough sketch up tomorrow morning if it will help.

All the best,
Jason

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Old 02-21-2012, 09:31 PM   #2
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I think 4 circuits is overkill, one for lighting in both rooms is probably enough. Given the planned office usage I would use a 20 amp for the receptacles.

Plan the receptacles so they are easily reached, not in the center of the headboard. You might consider quad receptacles behind the nightstands; one for the alarm clock, reading lamps, etc.

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Old 02-21-2012, 09:50 PM   #3
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You're going to put an office and a nursery in a 10 X 11 room?

I don't think that those two functions will mix...
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Old 02-21-2012, 09:51 PM   #4
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Thanks Jim,

I hadn't considered quads.

I misled you it appears, sorry. I meant that the current office is going to become the nursery.

Question about using a single circuit for lighting in both rooms. If I recall, there is a limit as to the number of lights on a circuit. I don't recall that number off the top of my head, but remember there is one. I say that as I believe I am at, or approaching it in the guest room.

4 recessed lights
2 recessed accent lights
2 reading lights (One each side of bed)
1 ceiling fan
1 closet light

If I am thinking correctly, IF everything was on, I believe there would be about 800 watts running, assuming standard incandesent bulbs. In my mind, wattage isn't the issue, just fearing I am approaching the limit on fixtures. Am I misremembering this limit?

Thanks for the ideas!
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Old 02-21-2012, 09:53 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kwilcox View Post
You're going to put an office and a nursery in a 10 X 11 room?

I don't think that those two functions will mix...



No, I may be crazy, but I ain't stupid!!

Clearly I mis-spoke in my original post. The office is going to become the nursery...
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Old 02-21-2012, 09:55 PM   #6
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Are you in Canada? In the NEC there is no limit on the number of devices on a circuit in a residential setting.
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Old 02-21-2012, 10:02 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Port View Post
Are you in Canada? In the NEC there is no limit on the number of devices on a circuit in a residential setting.
Northern Illinois.

Hmmmm, well if that is the case, I certainly can rethink this a bit!!

My initial thought was as follows...

Circuit 1: Outlets in Guest room
Circuit 2: Outlets in Nursery
Circuit 3: Lights in both rooms
Circuit 4: Outlets on common wall between the two rooms, for wall mounted TV in each room with "isolated ground".

Then had this thought about the number of fixtures, so was thinking of a 5th circuit for lighting in Nursery.

Gonna go hit the books again, I swear I saw that, but I, am a pilot, not an electrician. Ask me to fly you and your family somewhere, I'm your guy. Solve complex electrical issues, that's what electricians are for!!

This though, I think I can handle, just talking it through, and looking for ideas

Jim, if you will be back tomorrow, I will get a drawing up somehow, web isn't my thing. Picture is likely worth a thousand words.

Thanks,
Jason

Last edited by jamesjv8; 02-21-2012 at 10:06 PM.
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Old 02-21-2012, 10:09 PM   #8
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There is no need for an isolated ground in a residential setting.

The 800 watts would be less than 1/2 the circuit capacity.
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Last edited by Jim Port; 02-21-2012 at 10:18 PM.
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Old 02-21-2012, 10:15 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesjv8 View Post
Thanks Jim,

I hadn't considered quads.

I misled you it appears, sorry. I meant that the current office is going to become the nursery.

Question about using a single circuit for lighting in both rooms. If I recall, there is a limit as to the number of lights on a circuit. I don't recall that number off the top of my head, but remember there is one. I say that as I believe I am at, or approaching it in the guest room.

4 recessed lights
2 recessed accent lights
2 reading lights (One each side of bed)
1 ceiling fan
1 closet light

If I am thinking correctly, IF everything was on, I believe there would be about 800 watts running, assuming standard incandesent bulbs. In my mind, wattage isn't the issue, just fearing I am approaching the limit on fixtures. Am I misremembering this limit?

Thanks for the ideas!
Id keep the circuits in the 2 rooms seperate if you have room in your panel for it anyway,makes maintenance much easier
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Old 02-22-2012, 09:06 AM   #10
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https://skydrive.live.com/redir.aspx...153&parid=root

The above link is a rough sketch of the Guest room. I should mention that along the West wall of the room, there is a 60" by 60" window, centered on that wall.

I greatly appreciate your thoughts and ideas...

Thanks,
Jason
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Old 02-22-2012, 09:24 AM   #11
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First thing, I'm gonna comment on your questions:

4 circuits is def overkill. 1 for the lights and 1 for the receptacles would be good. Receptacles being afci. You can do the switched receptacles if you want, but imho it isn't required. Would you be using them to control lamps? If that's the case they are located beside the bed so very easy to turn on and off. I understand the point to your thread, being, if you could do anything you wanted to this room electrically, what would it be. That being said, there is no value in running surplass circuitry if it isn't required.

Good luck.

Secondly, what I really want to know is what you fly and who you fly for? You don't have to answer the second question, but the first would be appreciated.
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Old 02-22-2012, 09:30 AM   #12
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Currently out of work, like so many others...

I flew business jets, Citation variety, CE-550s, and CE-650s.

Thanks for the thoughts.

Oh, before I forget, Is AFCI required for lighting AND outlets? I know it says "bedroom circuits", and completely willing to do the right thing, just curious. It would strike me that it is. One wonders then why AFCI isn't required on all circuits. Just thinking out loud...

Best,
Jason

Last edited by jamesjv8; 02-22-2012 at 09:33 AM.
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Old 02-22-2012, 10:25 AM   #13
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Initially AFCI was only required for bedroom receptacles, then moved into bedroom outlets which includes the lighting. Now (note is is a paraphrase) AFCI protection is required pretty much everwhere except where GFI protection is required.
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Old 02-22-2012, 10:42 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesjv8 View Post
Currently out of work, like so many others...

I flew business jets, Citation variety, CE-550s, and CE-650s.

Thanks for the thoughts.

Oh, before I forget, Is AFCI required for lighting AND outlets? I know it says "bedroom circuits", and completely willing to do the right thing, just curious. It would strike me that it is. One wonders then why AFCI isn't required on all circuits. Just thinking out loud...

Best,
Jason
I hear ya man. Flying was my dream and still is, but I came to my senses and became an Engineer instead. I still look to the sky from my desk though lol.

Sorry for the off topic convo.
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Old 02-22-2012, 11:02 AM   #15
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Just got off phone with my village inspector...

"Not more than 10 openings on a 15 amp circuit."

So, there's that. I wasn't going to ask for a reference on that number as I sill need him to sign off the project. I like the guy, don't get me wrong, I just know from past experience with other inspectors, if they don't agree, they won't sign off.

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No worries, I look up all the time. I also live under the local traffic pattern, so that seems to remind me many times a day

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