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-   -   knob and tube & panel change questions (http://www.diychatroom.com/f18/knob-tube-panel-change-questions-54816/)

jwd 10-10-2009 02:38 AM

ADDED PICS! knob and tube & panel change questions
 
Hello all of you knowledgable people!
I am new here and would appreciate some feedback on my questions..:)

I am having a problem with my electrical panel. I have an old house the panel reads
2 pole/125 v
30 amp
CAT# HP2089

What I would like to do is upgrade to a larger panel. The current panel has 2 screw in 20 amp fuses. I would like to remove the old panel and replace with a new version, with reg breakers and slowly add more outlets throught the house as time and money come along. Is it possible to add a larger panel with the existing service? I really do not want to get any of the local building and safety, nor sce to run a larger main line from the pole involved. Any good news and helpful info?
Thank you, Joe

frenchelectrican 10-10-2009 03:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwd (Post 338634)
Hello all of you knowledgable people!
I am new here and would appreciate some feedback on my questions..:)

I am having a problem with my electrical panel. I have an old house the panel reads
2 pole/125 v
30 amp
CAT# HP2089

What I would like to do is upgrade to a larger panel. The current panel has 2 screw in 20 amp fuses. I would like to remove the old panel and replace with a new version, with reg breakers and slowly add more outlets throught the house as time and money come along. Is it possible to add a larger panel with the existing service? I really do not want to get any of the local building and safety, nor sce to run a larger main line from the pole involved. Any good news and helpful info?
Thank you, Joe

I hate to be a bearer of bad news but if you have main fuse only have either 20 or 30 amp fuse that is pretty much very old school set up and you will have to upgrade to minum of 100 amp service per NEC code and this is very strict and with service upgrading that is typically done by electricians and there is tons of rules to follow it.

The other thing is that with old knob and tube system they have some goofy connections going on normally it ok in very old days but with modern code you CAN NOT extend it so the only way you can do it right is replace them with new NM { romex } cables you can able fish it in without much issue however it depending on the type of house framing it is have with very old home typically can be ballon frame type it will be very easy to pull the cables in but you will hit a draft or fire stop about half way up the wall .

I am sure other members can fill you in more details here

Merci,Marc

jwd 10-10-2009 04:01 AM

Thank you Marc for getting back with me.
would the service coming in likely be larger than 30 amps and capable of a 100 amp panel? I figured that the romex would need to be ran. What gauge is the standard use on a 100 amp panel?

frenchelectrican 10-10-2009 04:17 AM

I just want to clear up a details or two before it get confusing here.,

Are you sure that you have main fuse just two - 20 amp fuses for the whole house ?

I have see 30 amp 120 volt service in USA and yeah couple of them left in France as well anyway let stick with USA side for now.

The key issue is how big the riser or SE cable you have now that from the POCO to the meter then from the meter to the fuse box typically with 120 v 30 amp service it will have #10 AWG { 6.0mm˛} copper verison.

Now for 100 amp service it will have much bigger size on conductor itself it will have either #2{35mm˛} AL or CU or #1{50mm˛}AL or 1/0 {55mm˛}AL conductor depending on the set up and local codes may affect the size but most common is #2 { 35mm˛} along with proper sized meter socket some are rated at 100 amp and some are rated at 200 amp.

If you can able upload the photo we can able tell excatly what you have with your situation and it will really help us more clear what is going on with it.

Merci,Marc

jwd 10-10-2009 04:45 AM

Hello Marc,
I have no idea how to get a photo on here. If you could email me I will send you some pictures that I just took.and perhaps that will help. I reall appreciate your time.
Thanks, Joe
JWD@ca.rr.com

kbsparky 10-10-2009 05:02 AM

From your description, you have a 120 Volt only service, with 2 circuits for the entire house. Typical of what was installed nearly 100 years ago.

It may be possible that one of those fuses is on the neutral conductor, in which case you only have one circuit.

You will need to "start from scratch" as they say in this case. Time to start socking some $$$ away, so you can afford to call in an electrician. :huh:

jwd 10-10-2009 05:50 AM

Hello kbsparky, I have some pictures, I just dont know how to put them on here. I am not sure what a "nuetral conductor" is, what I do know is that one of the fuses serves one part of the house and the other another side.
J

AllanJ 10-10-2009 08:12 AM

It is not unusual to install a new up to date (100 or more amp 120/240 volt) breaker panel and make the old two-fuse panel into a subpanel leaving the latter in its current location. The old system remains in use while you add new circuits.

If the (knob and tube attached) wires are not 12 gauge, then you need to remove the 20 amp fuses and insert 15 amp fuses.

Some cities require separate permits for a new main panel and for a new service drop (cables from utility pole; riser). The service drop must be upgraded to match the main breaker in your new panel.

>>> I'm not sure what a neutral conductor is.
If you have worked with electronics or automotive electrical systems or battery powered devices, think of the neutral as "the negative wire or terminal" but do not say that word to a household or commercial electrician.

With the two fuses, one serving each side of the house, there should be four wires coming to the panel from the house wiring. The two wires attached to the fuse terminals are hot and the other two are the neutrals respectively.

joed 10-10-2009 12:06 PM

To post a picture on here you need to store the picture on a web site like photobucket.com. That site will provide with a link to use to post your pic. Copy the link. Then when you come here if you click on the fourth icon from the left on the bottom row you can paste that link and the picture will appear here.

Don't make the picture huge. It should be 800 x 600 at most. Rotate the picture so it is right side up. I hate looking at sideways pictures.

jwd 10-10-2009 12:37 PM

panel and wire pictures
 
Thank you for any and all help. I hope these pictures are viewable.

http://i800.photobucket.com/albums/y...1010090126.jpg

http://i800.photobucket.com/albums/y...010090123b.jpg


http://i800.photobucket.com/albums/y...010090123a.jpg

http://i800.photobucket.com/albums/y...1010090123.jpg

http://i800.photobucket.com/albums/y...010090122a.jpg

http://i800.photobucket.com/albums/y...1010090122.jpg

frenchelectrican 10-10-2009 01:42 PM


Jwd can you fix the link a little due one letter in the link got my computer stopped for a min just look at the link " //s " that what causing the issue the first one " //i " that one it open up on me just fine

Merci,Marc

jwd 10-10-2009 01:43 PM

I am hoping someone will check out the pictures and help. :thumbup:

jwd 10-10-2009 01:57 PM

Sorry about that Marc,
They are fixed now. Thanks for your patience.
Joe

jwd 10-10-2009 02:07 PM

Im still checking in often if anyone wants to pipe in....please do. Thanks

joed 10-10-2009 04:45 PM

Let's make the picture viewable right here.

http://i800.photobucket.com/albums/y...1010090126.jpg

http://i800.photobucket.com/albums/y...010090123b.jpg

http://i800.photobucket.com/albums/y...010090123a.jpg

http://i800.photobucket.com/albums/y...010090122a.jpg

http://i800.photobucket.com/albums/y...1010090122.jpg


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