Kitchen Electrical - DIY Chatroom

caseyatbat · 11-06-2009, 10:51 PM

Hello,

I'm going through a kitchen replacement. The existing kitchen has two split 15s, one is running two plugs over one counter (opposite sides of a sink) and 2 wall outlets, the other connects two plugs over countertops (opposite sides of the stove), the fridge, range/micorowave, wall plug and a dining room light. A circuit for lights in the kitchen. One circuit for the dishwasher.

I know the second split is completely wrong.

The new kitchen will have;
4 plugs over one countertop two on each side of the sink (one split 15 chaining one plug from each side of the sink)
Two plugs over another countertop separated by another sink (split 15)
Separate circuits for fridge (15A)
Dishwasher (15A)
Another circuit for kitchen lights (8 recessed, three pendant, 1 laundry room light and the Dining room light will be moved onto it)
One breaker for 1200W of in cabinet and undercabinet 12V lighting
A final circuit for microwave and four wall outlets.

Am I on the right track? If my description is not clear please let me know. The image below is a picture/diagram.

http://picasaweb.google.com/CaryConnolly/Kitchen#5401185374680581890

Any advice is appreciated.

Thanks

CC

Bob Mariani · 11-07-2009, 07:00 AM

nope. Kitchen outlets need to be on 20 amp circuits. These also need to be GFI. You should review the NEC code which also details locations required.

InPhase277 · 11-07-2009, 09:15 AM

What you propose may work in Canada, but it is not legal under the NEC in the U.S.

darren · 11-07-2009, 09:37 AM

Inphase we are required to put 20A GFI in the kitchen now if they are within 5 feet of the sink, so that wouldn't be right in Canada either.

Knucklez · 11-07-2009, 11:40 AM

5 feet? i thought it was 1 meter. -eh?

ESA is removing adjacency rule.

your dishwasher, does it requrie 20A (some do). if it is hard wired (common) then you require a special breaker that can lock off.

if you have an eating area with a receptacle near by, that receptacle must be independently supplied, just like your fridge.

microwave should be 20A

Knucklez

darren · 11-07-2009, 01:13 PM

I beleive it is 1.5M from the sink, i could look in the code book but that would involve haveing to find the book first.

adpanko · 11-07-2009, 01:14 PM

You're two strings of countertop outlets need to each be 20A, not 15A, and put them on GFCI. NEC says you need at least 2 20A "small appliance" circuits. That effectively means your countertop outlets. And as for GFCI protecting them, you can just put in a GFCI outlet at the beginning of each string, and run normal (ie non GFCI) outlets downstream of them, but wired up so they are protected by the GFCI at the beginning of the stream.

Your lighting circuits sound fine: 15A for each should suffice judging from your description of what lights will be on each. Dedicated 15A refrigerator circuit is fine. Check the wattage of your dishwasher; dedicated 15A should be fine, but you may need 20A instead.

Is your microwave built-in or mounted over the stove, or is it free standing on countertop. If it is built-in or over the stove, you should have that on a dedicated circuit as well properly sized for its wattage.

And finally your oven. I see it is a 240V outlet you have now. Are you keeping the same oven? While you're doing all this work now, make sure your wiring for the oven is properly sized (ie what gauge) for the oven's required amperage. You possibly need 50A, or 6 gauge wire, depending on the oven.

joed · 11-07-2009, 01:26 PM

I think you are in Canada since you have splits in the kitchen.

In Ontario and similar in other provinces:

Receptacles within 1.5m of the sink must be GFCI. Best to run 20 amp non split circuits for those and use 20 amp T slot GFCI receptacles. GFCI on split receptacles requires a very expensive breaker.
Is the microwave a counter top unit?
Laundry room requires a dedicated circuit for washer. Other receptacles within the laundry room can be on the same circuit.

**Scuba_Dave** · 11-07-2009, 02:26 PM

OP's IP does indicate he is in Canada

caseyatbat · 11-07-2009, 02:41 PM

Hello,

I appreciate all the feedback.

Yes, I am in Canada (Ontario).

The microwave in built in plug not hard wired, 1000W and the other outlets will have minor usage.

For the countertop outlets if I go with 20A and GFI outlets, how many can I chain together. I assume the rule for no adjacent outlets is still in force except if separated by a sink (never understood that rule).

The issue with changing to 20A is replacing all the existing wiring that is 14/2 or 14/3. To change over to the 20A I will have to pull all the old and replace with 12/2. I thought that the existing split 15A circuits could stay.

Thanks Again.

CC

Knucklez · 11-07-2009, 02:57 PM

Quote:

assume the rule for no adjacent outlets is still in force

adjacency rule is being removed from ESA. i have a post somewhere else where i linked exactly to their website on this subject. i do not know if that is true TODAY or if it is sometime in the near future.

Knucklez

darren · 11-07-2009, 03:03 PM

The adjacent rule was taken out in the 2006 code book. Where is your microwave going in relation to your kitchen. If it was me I would run a seperate circuit for it.

caseyatbat · 11-07-2009, 03:11 PM

Hello,

Ok, if the adjacency is not longer in play, how many counter top outlets can I chain, can I include wall outlets?

The microwave may get its own circuit because of its location, I'll have lots of slots after the two 15 splits come out.

Thanks Again.

CC