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Old 05-12-2013, 07:00 AM   #1
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Junction box position in the attic


Hi all,

I am busy installing an exhaust fan in the bathroom and I mounted it where an unused light in the ceiling was, a perfect location so I have already the wiring.

I removed the junction box from the ceiling (4 cables in it) and according to the Canadian Electrical Code I am allowed to place it in the attic or crawl space (my case) with a head clearance of at least 35.4 in.

I am thinking to mount it on top of the joist, but then my question:

Am I allowed to cover it with the 12 in blown insulation?
Or, can I place it elsewhere above the insulation provided the 35.in distance from the roof is maintained?

Thank you!
Alex

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Old 05-12-2013, 08:26 AM   #2
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Junction box position in the attic


You are allowed to cover it.

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Old 05-12-2013, 12:38 PM   #3
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Junction box position in the attic


Hi again,

From the picture below, you will see the junction box I referred to.



For clarity:
in the bathroom there are:
  • Two mirror cabinets with lights
  • One light in a closet
  • Once light in the ceiling (the one I do not use and want to use for the fan)
  • One light switch that commands all
I numbered the cables 1-2-3-4, the wiring you see in the picture:

White from cable 1+3+4 pigtailed together
Black from cable 1+3+4 and White from cable 2 pigtailed together
Black from cable 2 is connected to Red from cable 3
Bare ground= 1+2+3+4

I have identified that cable 2 is the once going to the light switch and it is the only cable to the light switch.

What I want to achieve is the following:

Command the lights as before with the light switch
I bought this timer to be added next to the light switch which obviously has to work independently.

What's the best way to do it?
Shall I extend the existing cable that was providing the current to light fixture in the ceiling (which is my intention to use for the fan) down to the light switch or is there a simpler way?

Thank you!
Alex
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Old 05-12-2013, 05:46 PM   #4
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Junction box position in the attic


To add another switch to the box will require the cable to the switch box to be changed to a 14/3 from a 14/2. Right now you have a switch loop. The power goes to the switch on the white and comes back controlled by the switch on the black. You need one more wire to add a second switch to the box, in order to bring back a second switched power wire.
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Old 05-13-2013, 09:05 AM   #5
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Junction box position in the attic


Quote:
Originally Posted by joed View Post
To add another switch to the box will require the cable to the switch box to be changed to a 14/3 from a 14/2. Right now you have a switch loop. The power goes to the switch on the white and comes back controlled by the switch on the black. You need one more wire to add a second switch to the box, in order to bring back a second switched power wire.
Hi,

Thanks for you suggestion.
Would you please tell me how to wire the whole thing once I have the 14/3 in place?

I can probably figure it out myself once I am there, but I feel more comfortable if an expert backs up my theories.

Thanks
Alex
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Old 05-13-2013, 07:11 PM   #6
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Junction box position in the attic


The current cable should have the white connected to the black power in the junction box. The black is the switch controlled power coming back from the switch.
With the new cable the same thing happens to the black and white. In the switch box the white connects to one terminal on both switch. Then the black connects to one switch and the red to the other switch.
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Old 05-13-2013, 07:40 PM   #7
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Junction box position in the attic


Quote:
Originally Posted by joed View Post
The current cable should have the white connected to the black power in the junction box. The black is the switch controlled power coming back from the switch.
With the new cable the same thing happens to the black and white. In the switch box the white connects to one terminal on both switch. Then the black connects to one switch and the red to the other switch.
Thank you Joed.
I will post the result once everything is up and running.

Cheers
Alex
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Old 05-16-2013, 09:55 PM   #8
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Junction box position in the attic


Quote:
Originally Posted by joed View Post
The current cable should have the white connected to the black power in the junction box. The black is the switch controlled power coming back from the switch.
With the new cable the same thing happens to the black and white. In the switch box the white connects to one terminal on both switch. Then the black connects to one switch and the red to the other switch.
Hi,

I had a problem with the wiring, basically since it is a retrofit installation, the existing 14/2 cannot be removed, therefore I did another hole and added another 14/2 for the timer.

Now, when I look at the timer, I have:

Black
White
Green
Red
Yellow/Red

Can I just connect the white with white and black with the black and then in the junction box, the white with the other whites and the black with the red?

I am asking because in the wiring diagram of the timer there is the red too and I wonder if I have to use it to get the timer to work correctly.

I attach the wiring diagram for convenience.

DivShare File - UTF-8_en-us_Instruction Sheet.pdf

Thank you!
Alex
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Old 05-17-2013, 07:47 AM   #9
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Junction box position in the attic


Can't see the picture unless I sign up. Post it someplace viewable.

It is likely the timer needs a neutral and it would have been better to run a 14/3.
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Old 05-17-2013, 08:34 AM   #10
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Junction box position in the attic


Quote:
Originally Posted by joed View Post
Can't see the picture unless I sign up. Post it someplace viewable.

It is likely the timer needs a neutral and it would have been better to run a 14/3.
When you click the link, click the download button and after 15 sec. it will offer you the possibility to open the Pdf, no need to sign-up.

I cannot upload this file on the forum as it is bigger than the allowed size

I think that the reason behind the multiple wiring is because there is a switch ON/OFF in the timer in addition to the actual timer buttons...

Alex
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Old 05-17-2013, 11:48 AM   #11
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Junction box position in the attic


Still can't see. It is a blocked site here at work. Must be a spammer type page.
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Old 05-17-2013, 12:22 PM   #12
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Junction box position in the attic


Rehosted.

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Old 05-17-2013, 03:14 PM   #13
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Junction box position in the attic


Techy, Thank you!
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Old 05-17-2013, 09:09 PM   #14
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Junction box position in the attic


Quote:
Originally Posted by joed View Post
Can't see the picture unless I sign up. Post it someplace viewable.

It is likely the timer needs a neutral and it would have been better to run a 14/3.
OK, here is my interpretation on how it should work:

If I leave the junction box as it is now (see picture in my post #3), we have :
Cables #1-2-3-4 + new 14/3 cable (# 5) that goes from the timer to the junction box and the fan:

Here below what I would do (but I won't till you confirm I am right):

White of the timer and white of the fan connected to all other whites:
1-3-4-5
Black of the timer connected to the red of cable # 3
Red of the Timer connected to the black of the fan
Bare of the Timer to all other bares

To summarize:
  • White from cable 1+3+4+5+fan pigtailed together
  • Black from cable 1+3+4 and White from cable 2 pigtailed together
  • Red of the Timer connected to the Black of the fan
  • Black from cable 2 and 5 is connected to Red from cable #3
  • Bare ground= 1+2+3+4 + Green 5 and Green of the fan
Please, let me know if I'm on the right track so that tomorrow I can work on it.

Many thanks!
Alex
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Old 05-18-2013, 06:51 AM   #15
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Junction box position in the attic


Hi Joed,

Can you or anybody in the forum tell me if I am on the right track with the connections above?
I am stuck with my job in the attic, waiting for your confirmation

Thank you guys, I really appreciate your help.

Alex

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