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Old 05-22-2009, 11:46 PM   #16
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I think my electrician messed up...help!


It's hard to tell from the picture... what size conduit did your electrician run and what size wire did he put in it? Are both sized correctly for a 100a sub-panel?

IMO, I don't think that it's a very pretty conduit installation. I would have tried to set the panel so I could have taken the conduit into the top of panel. Perhaps by bending a 90 with a kick to bump it out from the horizontal beam.

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Old 05-23-2009, 12:21 AM   #17
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I think my electrician messed up...help!


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It's hard to tell from the picture... what size conduit did your electrician run and what size wire did he put in it? Are both sized correctly for a 100a sub-panel?

IMO, I don't think that it's a very pretty conduit installation. I would have tried to set the panel so I could have taken the conduit into the top of panel. Perhaps by bending a 90 with a kick to bump it out from the horizontal beam.

Not sure about the conduit, but the wire is 3 gauge.
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Old 05-23-2009, 10:56 AM   #18
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I think my electrician messed up...help!


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If conduit can/is being used as the ground does thee 90 to the panel need to be metal too, or is the use of plastic ok?
Think about it for just a minute


I would have made it more asthetically pleasing but it's NEC compliant. In my area, we must pull a ground. Never a bad idea IMO.
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Old 05-23-2009, 11:16 AM   #19
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I think my electrician messed up...help!


He should of used a bonding bushing at least those look like concentric knockouts to me.
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Old 05-23-2009, 11:30 AM   #20
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You are good to go. Install a ground terminal asap. Like InPhase said. Before you forget. Keep the grounds and neutrals separated. Make sure the installer did not install the green screw into the neutral bus and enclosure. If he did, remove it.

The conduit looks like a DIY install, but is satisfactory. That LB was not needed. It could have been done better/neater.
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Old 05-23-2009, 11:33 AM   #21
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I think my electrician messed up...help!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jupe Blue View Post
It's hard to tell from the picture... what size conduit did your electrician run and what size wire did he put in it? Are both sized correctly for a 100a sub-panel?
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Originally Posted by jailbird371 View Post
Not sure about the conduit, but the wire is 3 gauge.
Assuming THHN/THWN, that puts you at a minimum 1" size EMT for the 3 conductors you have, and not enough room left in a 1" for a grounding conductor to be added.

(Tried to zoom in and read the barcode on the compression coupling, but couldn't read it without my glasses! )
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Old 05-23-2009, 11:44 AM   #22
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I think my electrician messed up...help!


#3 copper is good for 100 amps. 1" EMT is good for up to 3-#3s. A bond bushing is required only if the voltage is more than 250 to ground.

I believe the installation to be completely compliant, except for the lack of a ground bar. This would become a requirement only if one or more branch circuits contained a ground wire.

The fact that black, red, and white were used indicates a higher than normal level of pride in work. Most of us use all black, and tape the red and white.

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Last edited by micromind; 05-23-2009 at 12:07 PM.
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Old 05-23-2009, 12:07 PM   #23
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According to table C.1, 3-#3s is indeed the maximum for a 1" EMT. This table is not a requirement, it is provided for quick reference.

Chapter 9, table 1 is the actual requirement. (C1 is based on table 1). The cross-sectional area of 1" EMT at 40% fill is 0.346 Sq.in.

The cross sectional area of a #3 THHN is 0.0973 Sq.in. 3 of them = .2919 Sq.in ".

The cross sectional area of a #8 THHN is 0.0366 SQ.in.

If 3-#3s and 1-#8 were used, the result would be 0.3285 Sq.in in a conduit with a capacity of 0.346 Sq.in.

Legal, but it would be a hard pull!

A lot has been said about the LB here, possibly there is already 360 degrees of bend up to the LB, and another 45 to complete the offset would not be allowed.

Rob
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Old 05-23-2009, 12:18 PM   #24
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I think my electrician messed up...help!


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No, I didn't.
The reason I ask is that it has possible home owner's insurance implications. In my office we get lots of calls from people trying to track down proof an electrical permit was issued for a panel install, wiring expansion, etc. If there is a fire, the insurance company won't pay if it is an electrically caused fire, and electrically related work has been done without a permit. The insurance company will say, "The burden of proof that a permit was issued is on you, and if you can't prove it, we won't pay."
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Old 05-23-2009, 12:24 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by williswires View Post
Assuming THHN/THWN, that puts you at a minimum 1" size EMT for the 3 conductors you have, and not enough room left in a 1" for a grounding conductor to be added.

(Tried to zoom in and read the barcode on the compression coupling, but couldn't read it without my glasses! )

Couldn't I run a ground wire in a separate conduit?
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Old 05-23-2009, 01:12 PM   #26
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I think my electrician messed up...help!


Quote:
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Couldn't I run a ground wire in a separate conduit?
NO.
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Old 05-23-2009, 01:14 PM   #27
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Graphic courtesy of Mike Holt

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Answers based on the 2008 & 2011 NEC. If you're on the '14 already I feel sorry for you.
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Old 05-23-2009, 01:25 PM   #28
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I think my electrician messed up...help!


It looks to me that that is a PVC 90 degree connector. If it is, it wont conduct electric.

Further, the change of fittings between the 90 degree connectors to the panel doesnt make sense to me, doesnt look the way I'd have done it or had it done.

As most others re-iterated, I would have a separate ground run as if the conduit ever came loose at any fittings, you lose the grounding properties....and considering this is for a home theater, having a good ground on the audio system is important if you want to avoid a number of things....interference, ground loops and want to ensure your surge protectors and UPS function properly.

When I installed my 100 amp sub panel, I ran 4 wires from the main panel in the garage and put a main on the sub-panel.
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Old 05-23-2009, 01:29 PM   #29
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That is NOT a PVC LB. It is a painted cast piece.
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Old 05-23-2009, 05:00 PM   #30
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I don't have a whole lot of experience with commercial installations, but I have never seen a PVC LB with threads in them so I would assume it is of a metallic nature.

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