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-   -   House inspector says an ungrounded socket necessarily mean knob and tube? (http://www.diychatroom.com/f18/house-inspector-says-ungrounded-socket-necessarily-mean-knob-tube-163064/)

Quackerjack 11-12-2012 11:24 AM

House inspector says an ungrounded socket necessarily mean knob and tube?
 
Is this really true?

I have some ungrounded electrical sockets in my house. The house inspector says reported that means I have old know and tube wiring. And so the buyer says he wants $15,000 off the agreed upon price.

If it's not true, isn't there a way to see from the wires in the sockets, whether it is knob and tube?

In your reply could you please let me know whether you are a licensed electrician?

gregzoll 11-12-2012 11:35 AM

They can tell by just going to the panel and looking at the wiring entering it, poking their head in a attic or crawl space, also by the age of the home. Or as simple as just looking at the outlets.

In this market, I would take anything from a buyer and let them deal with the rewiring of the K&T.

joed 11-12-2012 11:48 AM

Ungrounded could mean two things. Do you have two prong receptacles or do you have three prong receptacles that test no ground? How old is your house?
You can refuse and tell them to take it as is or leave. How hard up are you to sell?

Quackerjack 11-12-2012 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gregzoll (Post 1050309)
They can tell by just going to the panel and looking at the wiring entering it, poking their head in a attic or crawl space, also by the age of the home. Or as simple as just looking at the outlets.

In this market, I would take anything from a buyer and let them deal with the rewiring of the K&T.

Thanks for the reply but that doesn't answer my question.

The house inspector said "the fact that there is no ground means it is knob and tube wiring". He just plugged in that little ground detector to determine that.

BUT I had a prior inspector who was an actual city building inspector uncover a light switch cover plate and say that it's not knob and tube wiring.

I am trying to establish whether someone can validly say: "the fact that there is no ground means it is knob and tube wiring"

joecaption 11-12-2012 11:55 AM

The fact there is no ground does not automaticly mean it's knob and tube!
As stated a simple look in the attic, outlet, or under the house should be able to tell what it is.
Knob and tube looks nothing like any other type of wiring, so any nob can look at it and know.
http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=...B0D51&first=75

Quackerjack 11-12-2012 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joed (Post 1050322)
Ungrounded could mean two things. Do you have two prong receptacles or do you have three prong receptacles that test no ground? How old is your house?
You can refuse and tell them to take it as is or leave. How hard up are you to sell?

What are the two things it could mean?

The sockets have three prongs that test with no ground.

I'm not hard up to sell but I want to deal with known facts.

Quackerjack 11-12-2012 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joecaption (Post 1050333)
The fact there is no ground does not automaticly mean it's knob and tube!
As stated a simple look in the attic, outlet, or under the house should be able to tell what it is.
Knob and tube looks nothing like any other type of wiring, so any nob can look at it and know.
http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=...B0D51&first=75

Excellent -- thank you for answering my question. I didn't think so. Unfortunately, I don't have an attic or areas with the wiring exposed. Any other way to tell?

ddawg16 11-12-2012 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quackerjack (Post 1050324)
Thanks for the reply but that doesn't answer my question.

The house inspector said "the fact that there is no ground means it is knob and tube wiring". He just plugged in that little ground detector to determine that.

BUT I had a prior inspector who was an actual city building inspector uncover a light switch cover plate and say that it's not knob and tube wiring.

I am trying to establish whether someone can validly say: "the fact that there is no ground means it is knob and tube wiring"

What it really means (based on face value of just that statement), the inspector does not know his K&T from from his a$$ hole.

The existing part of my house does not have grounded outlets......I do NOT have K&T.

jbfan 11-12-2012 12:06 PM

How old is the house?
Grounding type receptacles on an ungrounded circuit are a code violation, unless protected by gfci.

Just testing the receptacle will not tell if you have knob and tube, or an old 2 wire circuit.

gregzoll 11-12-2012 12:20 PM

If it was a Home Inspector, he is a idiot. I would go by what the City Inspector stated, or even get them back in and if they are willing to sign off that the electrical meets the grandfathered codes for them, then go for it, and use it to negotiate the sale.

Again, with this market, people are willing to take anything to get the sale from the buyer.

gregzoll 11-12-2012 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quackerjack (Post 1050343)
Excellent -- thank you for answering my question. I didn't think so. Unfortunately, I don't have an attic or areas with the wiring exposed. Any other way to tell?

Open up a outlet or even take the cover off of the breaker or fuse panel. How old is this house? As for the attic, if it is insulated, move some of the insulation and look.

As a homeowner, you should know what you house has for wiring, etc..

Quackerjack 11-12-2012 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gregzoll (Post 1050363)
Open up a outlet or even take the cover off of the breaker or fuse panel. How old is this house? As for the attic, if it is insulated, move some of the insulation and look.

As a homeowner, you should know what you house has for wiring, etc..

Ok what am I looking for in the outlet box or breaker panel? I'm guessing that the fact of having the black wire and white wire coming out of a single sheathing means that it is not knob and tube but that's only my guess ...

Bobka 11-12-2012 05:27 PM

...just cause there is no ground wire doesn't mean it is K&T !!!! there is a ton of old 2 wire style romex out there...there are ways to make it safer..:thumbsup:....how old is your home??

Quackerjack 11-12-2012 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobka (Post 1050556)
...just cause there is no ground wire doesn't mean it is K&T !!!! there is a ton of old 2 wire style romex out there...there are ways to make it safer..:thumbsup:....how old is your home??

Thanks Bobka. I've since read recommendations to install GFCI outlets. Not sure on the house's age but the oldest part was once a small one bedroom house that's over 45 years in my estimation.

gregzoll 11-12-2012 05:57 PM

You can check with the city, they would have record when it was built, and when any remodeling happened.


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