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Old 11-25-2012, 09:25 PM   #31
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Help with new 220V sub panel circuit


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This right here tells me he's going to do what he wants.
If he has a circuit going to the garage, he can not run another!
What are you talking about dude? Of course I have to run another circuit to the garage. I sure as hell can't use the 110 circuit that's going there now. What's up with not offering any helpful information and now only piping in to make negative and assumptive comments, exactly what is not needed. Besides, I never said I wouldn't try to be as compliant as possible, I simply meant that as long as the circuit is safe and correct per what is generally acceptable, I wasn't going to worry about crossing T's and dotting I's just to satisfy an inspection that is NOT imminent, and, that I intended to install a larger main panel at some point. Now that I know I can do some finagling with the breakers themselves, it actually becomes a moot point.

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Old 11-25-2012, 09:28 PM   #32
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Help with new 220V sub panel circuit


Not really, you cannot run multiple circuits to a detached structure. You could pull one multi wire branch circuit up to 20A, but anything over that, you will need a sub panel.
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Old 11-25-2012, 09:35 PM   #33
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Help with new 220V sub panel circuit


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Originally Posted by frenchelectrican View Post
I was reading thru on this one and I will address to the OP .,

Seince you mention you want to run the air compressour the only way you can do this in legit way is you have to ditch the exsting circuit and run a new circuit to the detached garage with new subpanel and one circuit for your air compressour and other circuits as needed in the garage.

There are few legit metholds you will have to use .,


A ) PVC conduit buried in the ground that have to be 18 inches deep and use 1.25 inch pvc with 4 conductors 3 X 6 awg conductors and 1 X10 gauge conductor ( 6 awg black, red , white and 10 awg green unless your code required the green to be #6 then do it.)

B ) Direct bural UF cable 6-3 UF cable that have to be 24 inches ( unless other depth per your local codes ) but you will need larger conduit due the 6-3 UF cable is pretty wide so therefore 1.5 inch is bare minum for riser for protection.

I rather just run all the way thru with PVC and with THHN/THWN conductors and be done with it.

Of course you will need two ground rods as well.

Again., keep the netural and ground seperated.

Merci,
Marc
Yeah, not to contradict you, and I'm not sure what country you're in, but here, in Pueblo, CO, I believe you would be wrong. Just last year we had a licensed electrician add another circuit for some additional outlets to our other outbuilding and he ran completely separate cabling from what was already running to it. It was also inspected and there was no indication of it being any kind of problem. Don't know what you were intending. Did you intend to say that the existing wiring running to the garage would have to be ripped out in order to run a 220 circuit to it? If so, I'd like some other people to chime in with comments about the necessity of what he's talking about, in your geographic areas, because I find this extremely hard to believe anybody would do. Especially on a remote building. Maybe I'm wrong, but I do know they didn't make us do that before to our other outbuilding.
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Old 11-25-2012, 09:37 PM   #34
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Help with new 220V sub panel circuit


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Originally Posted by darkbreeze View Post
What are you talking about dude? Of course I have to run another circuit to the garage. I sure as hell can't use the 110 circuit that's going there now. What's up with not offering any helpful information and now only piping in to make negative and assumptive comments, exactly what is not needed. Besides, I never said I wouldn't try to be as compliant as possible, I simply meant that as long as the circuit is safe and correct per what is generally acceptable, I wasn't going to worry about crossing T's and dotting I's just to satisfy an inspection that is NOT imminent, and, that I intended to install a larger main panel at some point. Now that I know I can do some finagling with the breakers themselves, it actually becomes a moot point.

I wrote two underline you can NOT run two seperated circuits to the detached garage at all this is a cut and dry answer there is no otherway around.

The moot point is doing it right from first time will save yourself alot of headache there.

Merci,
Marc
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Old 11-25-2012, 09:41 PM   #35
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Help with new 220V sub panel circuit


Code states that you can only run one circuit to an out building.
Just because the electricians and inspecttors in your area do not follow code is not our problem.
You have been told by 3 electricians that you can not run another circuit to your shed, but you do not want to listen.

When people say that they do not care if it is to code, I do not help!
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Old 11-25-2012, 10:03 PM   #36
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Help with new 220V sub panel circuit


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Code states that you can only run one circuit to an out building.
Just because the electricians and inspecttors in your area do not follow code is not our problem.
You have been told by 3 electricians that you can not run another circuit to your shed, but you do not want to listen.

When people say that they do not care if it is to code, I do not help!
So what you're trying to say, is that I would have to rip out the existing 110 volt circuit currently supplying power to all lights and receptacles in the garage, the 10/2 wiring I just ran to the garage for the compressor, AND then run like a single 6/4 bundle, install a subpanel in the garage, connect each of my 110 volt circuits in the garage to alternate legs in the subpanel, and run my compressor off both legs of the subpanel. In addition to which I would need to obtain a different subpanel with enough breaker spaces to accommodate all my 110 circuits, plus my 220 circuit. Is that what you're saying?
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Old 11-25-2012, 10:06 PM   #37
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Help with new 220V sub panel circuit


Yup...and install ground rods at the detached structure.
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Old 11-25-2012, 10:07 PM   #38
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Help with new 220V sub panel circuit


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Originally Posted by darkbreeze View Post
So what you're trying to say, is that I would have to rip out the existing 110 volt circuit currently supplying power to all lights and receptacles in the garage, the 10/2 wiring I just ran to the garage for the compressor, AND then run like a single 6/4 bundle, install a subpanel in the garage, connect each of my 110 volt circuits in the garage to alternate legs in the subpanel, and run my compressor off both legs of the subpanel. In addition to which I would need to obtain a different subpanel with enough breaker spaces to accommodate all my 110 circuits, plus my 220 circuit. Is that what you're saying?
That is correct.
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Old 11-25-2012, 10:17 PM   #39
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Help with new 220V sub panel circuit


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I'm confused. Why won't the compressor start?
You ******* listen. if he doesnt apply the neutral, the compressor wont start. With anything as in this situation you need your hot with neutral. Yes.. it will start without the ground- but not without a neutral!
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Old 11-25-2012, 10:21 PM   #40
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Help with new 220V sub panel circuit


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Originally Posted by darkbreeze View Post
So what you're trying to say, is that I would have to rip out the existing 110 volt circuit currently supplying power to all lights and receptacles in the garage, the 10/2 wiring I just ran to the garage for the compressor, AND then run like a single 6/4 bundle, install a subpanel in the garage, connect each of my 110 volt circuits in the garage to alternate legs in the subpanel, and run my compressor off both legs of the subpanel. In addition to which I would need to obtain a different subpanel with enough breaker spaces to accommodate all my 110 circuits, plus my 220 circuit. Is that what you're saying?
Oui., That is correct and the other reason why is that you only need one supply to the detached building instead of mulit supplys.

With 60 amp subpanel you will have MORE than plenty power what you have there.

Merci,
Marc
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Old 11-25-2012, 10:21 PM   #41
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Help with new 220V sub panel circuit


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Originally Posted by JuzRick View Post
You ******* listen. if he doesnt apply the neutral, the compressor wont start. In anything you need your hot with neutral. Yes.. it will start without the ground- but not without a neutral!
Do you seriously have an electrical license? Not everything requires a neutral...AC compressors, Baseboard Heaters, Some Hot Tubs....the list can go on and on.

Here is an air compressor that does not require a neutral...
http://www.aircompressorsdirect.com/...ssor/p334.html
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Old 11-25-2012, 10:23 PM   #42
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Help with new 220V sub panel circuit


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Originally Posted by JuzRick View Post
You ******* listen. if he doesnt apply the neutral, the compressor wont start. With anything as in this situation you need your hot with neutral. Yes.. it will start without the ground- but not without a neutral!
And where are you thinking I should connect the neutral? Just to make sure you understand this is a 220V compressor motor. There is NOTHING on the motor or pressure switch schematics that indicate a neutral wire. They both show two hot leads and a ground. Should I just pick a place and bolt it on there or what? (Sarcasm. Friendly sarcasm.) I guess I don't know what you are indicating. Are you indicating the neutral is necessary at the compressor end of things, or at the subpanel. I double checked my A/C unit circuit it has no neutral either. Just two hots and a ground.
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Old 11-25-2012, 10:24 PM   #43
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Help with new 220V sub panel circuit


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Originally Posted by JuzRick View Post
You ******* listen. if he doesnt apply the neutral, the compressor wont start. With anything as in this situation you need your hot with neutral. Yes.. it will start without the ground- but not without a neutral!
Eh., Excuse moi ., Not for 240 volts compressour motours they do NOT need netural for the useage.

The 240 volt circuit in USA/Canada side is two hot conductors but over here in European area where I am in France the 240 volts is hot to netural.

Merci,
Marc
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Old 11-25-2012, 10:29 PM   #44
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Help with new 220V sub panel circuit


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Originally Posted by JuzRick View Post
You ******* listen. if he doesnt apply the neutral, the compressor wont start. With anything as in this situation you need your hot with neutral. Yes.. it will start without the ground- but not without a neutral!
This is not correct. The neutral is only used to get 120. There are many 240 loads that do not utilize a neutral.
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Old 11-25-2012, 10:38 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by jbfan View Post
Code states that you can only run one circuit to an out building.
Just because the electricians and inspecttors in your area do not follow code is not our problem.
You have been told by 3 electricians that you can not run another circuit to your shed, but you do not want to listen.

When people say that they do not care if it is to code, I do not help!
Not being a smartass, but I was just told by two electricians on another forum that this is not correct and to ask you what section of NEC this violates. Thanks.

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