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Old 12-29-2013, 10:25 AM   #31
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Help needed: How do I ground my satellite dish?


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Originally Posted by k_buz View Post
You make an interesting point. Here in WI, we are preparing for mandatory licensing. I was told that this included low volt installations, and that those low volt companies would need permits to install their data systems. I am now curious if that will spill over to CATV/Sat installers?
It's only logical in my opinion, why should DISH installers be exempt from permits and inspections?

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Old 12-29-2013, 11:07 AM   #32
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Help needed: How do I ground my satellite dish?


The pic you show has a groundinf connectiona and such be connected to your grounding system that then connects to a ground rod or rods that are connected to one another. All utilties must connect to this grounding system. It may be a s easy as running a silid copper wire from the sat connector to the exposed solid copper wire that runs down the outside of your house to a ground rod. However, if your home has a UFER grounding system there will be no exposed grounding wire and no ground rod is required (but one may be present anyway). These system use the rebar in the concrete slab as a "ground rod". If you have this type of system you will have to connect the grounding wire from the sat connector to the ground strip in your panel.
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Old 12-29-2013, 12:42 PM   #33
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Help needed: How do I ground my satellite dish?


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You mean the same people that put orange cones around their truck when they are parked in your driveway?
That would be the CATV company. Comcast is really bad, when it comes to not properly following standards for grounding.
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Old 12-29-2013, 12:47 PM   #34
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Help needed: How do I ground my satellite dish?


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Originally Posted by Jim Port View Post
Given that the installers are paid piecework the faster they get done the more they can make. Doing it correctly does not add to the paycheck. They also may have never been taught correctly.
That all depends on the company. Not all operate like that.
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Old 12-29-2013, 12:51 PM   #35
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Help needed: How do I ground my satellite dish?


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I do not say not to bond the coax. I said the DISH doesn't need to be bonded unless it is the highest point on the house.
The info about the dish comes from the person who goes around and inspect other install to makesure they meet company standards.
Not so true. Just had a troubleshooting issue with someone, due to every time they would connect the HDMI cord from their DirecTV box to their new TV (two prong plug), they would get a Error 775 (Failed to communicate with dish).

When they rebooked up their old TV, it would work. Come to find out, the electrician that replaced their panel, failed to reconnect all communication ground wiresback on the Service Electrical ground for the structure.

As soon as DirecTV reconnected the ground, guess what, the problem went away. This person's dish is on a four foot pole in their yard.

Communication, video, networking is grounded for a reason (spelled out in IEEE Std. 1100).
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Old 12-29-2013, 02:16 PM   #36
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Help needed: How do I ground my satellite dish?


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Originally Posted by k_buz View Post
You make an interesting point. Here in WI, we are preparing for mandatory licensing. I was told that this included low volt installations, and that those low volt companies would need permits to install their data systems. I am now curious if that will spill over to CATV/Sat installers?
as i understand it, systems under 100v are exempt. that doesn't necessarily mean the work is exempt from requiring a permit or inspection, rather than the installer, repairman, etc. does not need to be a licensed electrician to work on it.
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Old 12-29-2013, 02:26 PM   #37
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Help needed: How do I ground my satellite dish?


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Originally Posted by itsnotrequired View Post
as i understand it, systems under 100v are exempt. that doesn't necessarily mean the work is exempt from requiring a permit or inspection, rather than the installer, repairman, etc. does not need to be a licensed electrician to work on it.

I found that earlier today, but didn't post anything about it because it was specific to WI and had no bearing on the thread.
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Old 12-29-2013, 06:44 PM   #38
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Help needed: How do I ground my satellite dish?


The OP is in CANADA so NEC does not apply. My answers are based on what happens in Canada.
Just to be clear I am talking about bonding the metal pole and dish not the coax. The coax needs the ground connection.
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Old 12-29-2013, 07:09 PM   #39
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Help needed: How do I ground my satellite dish?


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Originally Posted by DIYguy2000 View Post
My dish is mounted to the side of my house. There are two coax lines running from the dish directly inside to the electrical panel area. I do not see any grounding on the outside of my house for the dish.

On the inside, the two coax lines run through a grounding block (like this one: http://www.homedepot.ca/product/grou...g6-rg59/964991)

Two other coax lines are connected to the opposite side of the grounding block and lead directly to two rooms in the house, only one has a receiver on it.

I just discovered that the 14 gauge wire connected to the grounding block was tucked into a hole on the electrical panel, but wasn't actually connected to anything. So, how do I fix this?

- do I connect the grounding wire from the grounding block to the electrical panel ground? (is there a special clamp to do this?)
- is 14 gauge sufficient, or should it be bigger?
- should there be another ground on the outside of the home? (will I need a grounding rod? the electrical meter is on the opposite side of the house. Gas comes in at this point, and I believe has a ground on it, but it's covered in snow, so I'd have to go check it out or wait until spring.)

Any help would be much appreciated on how this should be done properly! Thanks so much!

Location: Ottawa, Ontario.
All installers I have seen (telephone, cable, satellite) simply find the nearest (metal, not pex) pipe and strap the ground to it. It saves you from opening the panel (which I don't believe they are qualified to do)

Last edited by Bob Sanders; 12-29-2013 at 07:11 PM.
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Old 12-29-2013, 07:44 PM   #40
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Help needed: How do I ground my satellite dish?


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All installers I have seen (telephone, cable, satellite) simply find the nearest (metal, not pex) pipe and strap the ground to it. It saves you from opening the panel (which I don't believe they are qualified to do)
They make special bonding blocks, that use a Split Bolt, to attach the block to the Earthing Ground, for the Electrical grounding for the structure.

If they do not have the block, they are supposed to either use the strap that bolts to the meter pan (Means scrapping a little paint, to make good contact for the bolts on the strap. Bad for the Meter pan. Due to it allows bare metal on the surface, then keeping the panel painted to protect from corrosion & rusting).

Other way, is using a Split Bolt attached to the Mains Earthing Ground, for the ground wire that goes to whatever incoming communication or antenna line.

The grounding of the coax shield, is so that if any static electricity, lightening, line comes in contact with an electrical wire, it gives you a safety measure, as stated in the IEE Green & Emerald books.

If you want to take it one step further on that CATV, antenna, telco, satellite, Ethernet. You can get Lightening Protectors fro L-Com.com.
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Old 12-29-2013, 10:22 PM   #41
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Help needed: How do I ground my satellite dish?


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Originally Posted by gregzoll View Post
They make special bonding blocks, that use a Split Bolt, to attach the block to the Earthing Ground, for the Electrical grounding for the structure.
Yup.
This is what is used here:


It clamps onto any standard metal pipe. I've also seen the split bolt connecting the ground directly to the ground strap from the panel to the water meter (I'm pretty sure it's not legal for installers to be opening the main panel anyway)

In the long run (here anyway) it doesn't really matter where the ground is connected just so long as it is connected to a legitimate ground.
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Old 12-30-2013, 11:46 PM   #42
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Help needed: How do I ground my satellite dish?


Huh. At work the staff electricians got upset when we originally insisted on bringing the grounds from the lightning arrestors for the outdoor wireless access points back to the electrical panel. The contractor interpreted the original "building steel" requirement as the nearest metal thing that they could find, without testing to see if it was actually bonded to ground or not, and in our view this was unacceptable both due to a lack of testing and due to a propensity for replacing metal pipe with plastic without bothering to jumper across. We told them to go back to the electrical panel to avoid this problem, and the electricians got upset by the possibility of destroying the electrical system if a lightning strike were actually carried right into the panel.

The solution that was agreed by the staff electricians, the contractor, and the consultant knowledgeable about the access points themselves was to drive a ground rod for the lightning arrestor, run a piece of conduit from the WAP enclosure down to the ground rod, and tie the supplied #14 from the lightning arrestor to the ground rod. The lightning arrestor is not designed to do any grounding for the normal operation of the low-voltage device, and the protection is not to protect the device itself, but to protect the building and other devices inside the building from lighting rather than malfunction. It seems that they considered the lightning arrestor to be a part of the building lightning protection system, rather than part of the electrical distribution system, so it fell into a different part of the NEC than electrical system grounding.

I am not an electrician, and I am not familiar enough with NEC to definitively state what any of this means, but what they were discussing sounded plausible, and also sounds like it might apply in this case.
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Old 12-31-2013, 05:27 AM   #43
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Help needed: How do I ground my satellite dish?






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Old 12-31-2013, 08:38 AM   #44
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Help needed: How do I ground my satellite dish?


TWX, lightening protection is a whole different subject. Yes, it does not get tied into building mains ground at the panel, but between the two grounding systems with a bonding jumper. Because as you stated, it is protecting the structure, not a group of circuits.

That means that the lightening protection would have their own ground rod system, not tied into the building mains grounding system.

You could run into three, maybe four different grounding systems in a facility, each with its own purpose.

See the following for further information:

3.9 APPLICABLE CODES.
The Lightning Protection Code, NFPA No. 780, issued by the National Fire Protection Association (3-9) contains the basic requirements for the minimization of personnel hazards in the event of a lightning strike to the structure.

The requirements of NFPA No. 780, however, are not sufficient to protect the electrical distribution system, signal and control cables, or sensitive electronic equipment from surges produced by either direct or indirect strokes. Thus additional steps such as providing lightning arresters on power lines and on outside signal and control cables, providing counterpoise cables for overhead and underground cables, providing comprehensive electromagnetic shielding on sensitive cables, and installing fast response surge protection devices on circuits exposed to lightning discharges should be taken. MIL-STD-188-124A refers.
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Old 12-31-2013, 08:41 AM   #45
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Help needed: How do I ground my satellite dish?


lightning protection system ground terminals are absolutely required to be bonded to the building or structure grounding electrode system.

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