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Old 01-19-2008, 03:42 PM   #16
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Hall light worked before installing a new light fixture in bathroom


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You have 110v at the recepticle but it won't power an appliance, what are you testing it with?
Yes, I tested it with a volt meter. One with the little hand that goes up when you stick the red probe and the black probe into the slots in the recepticle. It reads about one increment past the 100 mark. I think that should be 110.

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Old 01-19-2008, 04:00 PM   #17
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Hall light worked before installing a new light fixture in bathroom


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Did you replace an existing light fixture or is this a completely new fixture?

Can you describe what the wiring was like before you started? You must have commandeered a wire from something else to feed the new light or its switch.
I just replace an existing fixture. The fixture box has two cables coming in, one on one side and one on the other side. Each has one white, one black, and one bare wire. The old fixture had only 2 wires, one white and one black. The new fixture has 7wires. Three black, spliced together with one black coming out and three white, spliced together with one white coming out and the final one is a bare wire (copper). On the two cables coming into the box one white and one black are spliced together, the other white I spliced with the one white coming from the fixture and the other black I spliced the one black coming from the fixture. The bare wire from the fixture is grounded with a screw on the mount. The other 2 bare wires from the incoming cables are twisted together.
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Old 01-19-2008, 04:03 PM   #18
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Hall light worked before installing a new light fixture in bathroom


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Heh heh...anoher reason why they call it a suicide switch



Also....alway check a fixture with a KNOWN good bulb. Screw it in somewhere else or test continuity.
I checked that out today and the bulb works in a different fixture. Still not getting the light on in the hall way.
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Old 01-19-2008, 04:11 PM   #19
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Hall light worked before installing a new light fixture in bathroom


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Your power cable comes to the bathroom light fixture first then goes to the switch. By turning off the switch you only removed switched power but not constant incoming power in the fixture box. So you were working in the box with the incoming power still hot. Only the breaker is going to deenergize that constant hot wire.

See below diagram.

If there is a neutral in the hall switch box (not a switch loop like the bathroom) test the hot wire to the neutral (white) wire with the switch off. The white wire will not be connected to the switch, if so you have a switch loop. If the neutral is open somewhere you will not get a line voltage reading. If you do get line voltage then problem is probably at the light fixture box. If no neutral and it is a switch loop drop the fixture and look for a bad neutral connection, if you don't find one then test the hot incoming power black to the white neutral. Tell us the results.
I tested the switch in the hall with a voltmeter. It has 2 black wires hooked to the switch and 2 white wires spliced together and 2 bare wires twisted together. I put one probe on the top black wire and touched the other probe to the white wires that are spliced together with the switch off and it read 110v. If I touched the bottom black wire and the white it read nothing. If you touch both black wires it reads 110v.
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Old 01-19-2008, 05:12 PM   #20
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Hall light worked before installing a new light fixture in bathroom


Sounds like you need to drop the hallway light and see if you have a loose connection with the white wire but make sure that you have 110 volts on that other black wire (switched hot)when tested to the white or bare ground with the switch 'on'. You can also check at the fixture if you would rather do it that way. Got to have switched power or the switch is bad. However the fact that you have power at a wall receptacle but anything plugged into it will not work tells me you have an open in the neutral somewhere. You may have more than one thing going on as I don't see how the receptacle comes into play if you have line voltage at the switch testing hot to neutral.

Do you know if the receptacle and hallway light are on the same circuit breaker?
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Old 01-19-2008, 05:26 PM   #21
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Hall light worked before installing a new light fixture in bathroom


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I tested the switch in the hall with a voltmeter. It has 2 black wires hooked to the switch and 2 white wires spliced together and 2 bare wires twisted together. I put one probe on the top black wire and touched the other probe to the white wires that are spliced together with the switch off and it read 110v. If I touched the bottom black wire and the white it read nothing. If you touch both black wires it reads 110v.

The next logical step would have been to touch the bottom black wire with the switch in the ON position. This would confirm that the switch was working properly and you could move to the fixture.

You can test voltage st the lamp socket if you are CAREFUL. The tab at the base should be hot and the screw shell will be neutral. Should read 110/120.

Be CAREFUL. It;s like playing "Operation" but will flash burn instead of just buzz.
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Old 01-19-2008, 09:15 PM   #22
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Hall light worked before installing a new light fixture in bathroom


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Be CAREFUL. It;s like playing "Operation" but will flash burn instead of just buzz.
I'm envisioning a follow up thread: "METER LEAD WELDED TO LIGHT SOCKET - HOW TO REMOVE?" followed by second post, "METER WORKED BEFORE SHOWER OF SPARKS, NOW NOTHING-HELP!"
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Old 01-20-2008, 01:39 AM   #23
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Hall light worked before installing a new light fixture in bathroom


Whatever happened on this??? I seem to be having a simular problem. 3 switches on a breaker, all to lights, 1 inside, 2 outside (dusk to dawn). All were working until I replaced the 1 outside light. That light is working great......but now......neither of the others are. I will check the switches tomorrow on the other two. The one that works, I did replace the switch to a grounded switch because the other one wasn't and they had the ground wire just cut off and hanging out in the box. I looked at the other two but didn't notice anything crazy going on with them either. I do plan to replace them tomorrow. I am wondering if it is ok to have the breaker back on or no?? It ihas been on all evening and I didn't notice the other lights not working until my daughter cut them on, or tried to rather....lol. I know it isn't the bulbs.....but my lucking being what it is....will check that also. In the meantime......what else do I check if all else fails? The light that I wired had 3 cables coming in....one from source, one from switch (white and black hots) and one that ran to another light on the other corner of the house. I connected it pretty much the same way it was when I took the old motion detector light down, but had to cut the wires back and restrip because they kept breaking (I live in the desert and plastic protects nothing for long)......Can't figure why the others dont work for the life of me...........

Sorry for prob running on and I do hope it even makes sense.....its late and I need to hit the rack.......

Can't WAIT till the honey comes home from Iraq so he can do this crap,

J
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Old 01-20-2008, 09:38 AM   #24
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Hall light worked before installing a new light fixture in bathroom


Hi

The op of this thread is still working on his problem. It is best to start a new post or thread to avoid trying to work two different threads at once. Can you copy your post and submit a new thread for us? That will make things less confusing....thanks

Stubbie

BTW what is your husbands MOS sounds like he may be artillery or demo. Marine?
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Old 01-20-2008, 09:47 AM   #25
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Hall light worked before installing a new light fixture in bathroom


Boomer, On many forums it is considered rude to start a new thread when one of a similar nature already exists. On this site it is considered polite to start your own thread.

As for your problem, I will guess one of two situations. You have either made an error when you re wired the light fixture, or you have a wire that has become broken under a wirenut.
First see if the other two fixtures work when the first fixture is turned on. That would be an easy wiring mistake to make. Next check under each wirenut. It is very easy to knick the wire when stripping and when you tighen the wirenut the wire will break right where you knicked it.

If those two things do not fix the problem post back discribing all of the wires in the boxes that you worked on. Be specific as to what wires are from what cables and what they are currently hooked to or wirenutted with. Also include where you believe each cable goes next.

(for example: in the light box you may have three two wire cables. Cable one is white and black from the panel, cable two is white and black to the switch, cable three is white and black to the next light. Black from cable one is wirenutted with the black from cable 3 and white from cable two (this wire has been re-identified as a hot with black tape). Whites from cables one and three are wirenutted together and are hooked to the screw shell of the new fixture. Black from cable two is hooked to the center pin of the new fixture. ( I hope you understand what I am asking)
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Old 01-20-2008, 02:49 PM   #26
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Hall light worked before installing a new light fixture in bathroom


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I just replace an existing fixture. The fixture box has two cables coming in ...
From what you described, you connected the new fixture in the same manner as the old fixture used to be connected and everything else was left undisturbed and there are no loose wires left over.

The new fixture now works as you and also I expected.

Based on that, I say there is nothing wrong at the new fixture location and any other problems are rooted somewhere else.

When you mentioned you got a shock, did you at any time cause a big spark and/or a big pop and blow the breaker? This is a short circuit that could fry other joints and splices and connections upstream to the breaker box and give you problems of this kind. You would then have to examine all switches and receptacles and light fixtures through whose boxes the power feed traveled to check for loose connections.

If the meter is set to volts, at least 120 volts, and each meter lead tip touches no more than one thing, the leads won't weld.

Last edited by AllanJ; 01-20-2008 at 03:09 PM.
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Old 01-20-2008, 03:02 PM   #27
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Hall light worked before installing a new light fixture in bathroom


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I tested the switch in the hall with a voltmeter. It has 2 black wires hooked to the switch and 2 white wires spliced together and 2 bare wires twisted together. I put one probe on the top black wire and touched the other probe to the white wires that are spliced together with the switch off and it read 110v. If I touched the bottom black wire and the white it read nothing. If you touch both black wires it reads 110v.

If you have one probe on each of the two black wires of the switch and you read 110, see if you read the same when you change the switch position to "on".
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Old 01-20-2008, 03:51 PM   #28
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Hall light worked before installing a new light fixture in bathroom


Oh geez.....I didn't mean to be rude!...I'm sorry....lol....I'm just so frustrated with everything....The honey has been gone 5 months and it has been one thing like this right after another.....I know I will look back and laugh....and most of the time I do....just not lately cause I also have another small water leak to fix too....which means digging another 3 ft deep hole (wwwwwaaaahhhh)......I will def start a new thread after I do some of the things you guys suggested and start from there. Thanks for the suggestions of where to look......and Thanks for being patient with those of us who didn't realize that you fella's use proper manners too........lol.......

Boomer is a an anti tank assaultman MOS was 0351, after he made it past E5 its 0369 for a while I think.....believe it or not I am still learning all that too......Yes, USMC OOH-RAH! 16 yrs in and 4 to go......if they can get him to leave @ 20.....lol I still have a few months before he gets back and this winter is killing me......800 bux for propane for a month and a half, now I use alot of wood....guess I will be posting something on how to find a leak really soon too......lol

THANKS GUYS!!
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Old 01-21-2008, 08:54 AM   #29
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Hall light worked before installing a new light fixture in bathroom


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Originally Posted by Stubbie View Post
Your power cable comes to the bathroom light fixture first then goes to the switch. By turning off the switch you only removed switched power but not constant incoming power in the fixture box. So you were working in the box with the incoming power still hot. Only the breaker is going to deenergize that constant hot wire.

See below diagram.

If there is a neutral in the hall switch box (not a switch loop like the bathroom) test the hot wire to the neutral (white) wire with the switch off. The white wire will not be connected to the switch, if so you have a switch loop. If the neutral is open somewhere you will not get a line voltage reading. If you do get line voltage then problem is probably at the light fixture box. If no neutral and it is a switch loop drop the fixture and look for a bad neutral connection, if you don't find one then test the hot incoming power black to the white neutral. Tell us the results.
I brought some help with me on the hall light problem and he didn't know any more than I did. The hall sw and light are on the same wall as the bathroom light sw and of course the outlet that's acting wierd is on the wall in the bathroom. When you trip off the circuit breaker all three stop working including a light in a bedroom next to the hall. Now we took both light switches apart (removed the wires from them) hall way and bathroom. On the bathroom side there were 3 cables coming in. On the light switch there were one white, 2 blacks, on the top screw of the sw, one black on the bottom screw, 2 whites and a bare wire spliced together and 2 bare wires not connected to anything. On the back of the bathroom wall (in the hall) directly behind the light switch in the bathroom is the light sw for the hall light. It had 1 black attached to the top screw on the sw and 1 black on the bottom screw, 2 whites spliced together, and 2 bare wires twisted together. The light fixture for the hall is on the wall above the switch. Now I don't know how the wires go back together in the bathroom and was all that the way it should be"?
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Old 01-21-2008, 09:44 AM   #30
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Hall light worked before installing a new light fixture in bathroom


Two instant problems in the bathroom side switch box:

1. Two whites and a bare spliced together.

2. Two bare wires not connected to anything.

Mistakes of this kind make a professional suspicious of mistakes elsewhere and/or nearby.

Bare wires may not be used as neutrals. Grounds are always connected together wherever they come together. Neutrals are not grounded except at the main panel.

Given that in the bathroom switch box before you opened it up and took a look, all of the results you got so far are now considered unpredictable in nature.

Given those two problems now visible and also you have a variety of other wires disconnected and also you don't remember which went where, I am going to say that you will need ohmmeter knowledge (from a professional?) to figure out what wire goes where and get this thing fixed up.

Also consider:

3. White connected to black in a light fixture box.

4. Two blacks and a white connected together in the switch box (and connedted to the switch).

While these are not hard and fast mistakes, they would be if the whites I just mentioned were both ends of the same wire. A white connected to a black is proper only when it is the unswitched hot feed going to a switch where no other power comes in. But your switch box in #4 has other white wires (which should be neutrals). Given neutrals down in the switch box, something has to be wrong. A white may not convey power fed at a switch box up to a light. A white may not convey power down to a switch box where that unswitched power will continue elsewhere relying on neutrals that came from another elsewhere. Another job for an ohmmeter to trace.


Last edited by AllanJ; 01-21-2008 at 01:09 PM.
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