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Old 09-08-2011, 08:40 PM   #46
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Grounding Questions


ok i have an answer! im going to say it must be attached to the neutral bar because it is the way for electricity to go back to its source. By putting it on the neutral bar you limit alot of other connections for the electricity to return if there should ever be any type of issue. it would be the most sensible and direct area to do it. but all in all the electricity must go back to its source at the transformer and so forth. is that right?

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Old 09-08-2011, 09:00 PM   #47
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ok i have an answer! im going to say it must be attached to the neutral bar because it is the way for electricity to go back to its source. By putting it on the neutral bar you limit alot of other connections for the electricity to return if there should ever be any type of issue. it would be the most sensible and direct area to do it. but all in all the electricity must go back to its source at the transformer and so forth. is that right?
The neutral provides the return current path to the transformer. In normal operation of residential power there is no current (or voltage) in the ground wires. In fact, at the main panel, all the grounds and neutrals are tied together. But there it is, that big piece of bare copper, connecting the neutral bar to earth, but wait, that neutral bar is connected to the transformer center tap and case
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Old 09-08-2011, 09:11 PM   #48
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so just to hear a definite answer, my answer was right, correct? ill tell you it seems like alot of these principles would contradict themselves at face value until you really get down to detail and think about it in a deeper perspective. i feel like i have made a little progress today despite everything that has happened. there are plenty of people out there that can wire anything you ask them to but do not understand at all what is going on. i do not want to be one of these people and i do have some knowledge about how things work past the main breaker but like i have said before this area was really where i didnt get much experience so this is pretty much new to me, at least alot of the principles we have discussed. im sure knowing these basic concepts will help me to make more sense of other things i already knew or partially understood.
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Old 09-08-2011, 09:30 PM   #49
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The GEC and ground rod(s) are there to help dissipate voltage transients i.e. lightning strikes.
Think about this. You wire up a 20 amp circuit with 6 receptacles and bring that 12-2 into the panel and end up connecting the ground wire to the same bar as the neutral wire. The path back to the transformer is the neutral wire not the ground rod. There is another role of the ground system, it earth references the house electrical.
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Old 09-08-2011, 09:47 PM   #50
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well put, i understand now. once you know where everything goes its alot easier to understand how it all comes together. as for the small lug that is next to neutral lug in a main panel. what is that lug for?
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Old 09-08-2011, 09:50 PM   #51
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Sounds to me like the guy is ambitious and is probably building his own house somewhere in a rural area where inspections may be lax. Probably trying to bootleg his panel and meter and doesn't really know how and you guys are showing him how to be dishonest and circumvent the rules and regulations. He'll be gone when he gets enough answers to finally turn his lights on.
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Old 09-08-2011, 10:26 PM   #52
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are you kidding me man?? please keep it moving and dont post here if thats what you have to say. i dont know of many people even building houses where im at which used to be one of the fastest growing counties just a few years ago much less a 20 year old building a house! my money goes towards college and my bills, the last thing im interested in is building a house. i am genuinely here for knowledge, if i wanted to know how to rig a meter and main panel i could get that info easily from a variety of sources. some people amaze me.
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Old 09-08-2011, 10:34 PM   #53
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Well you are up to something perfidious now aren't you?
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Old 09-08-2011, 10:37 PM   #54
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definitely not. i dont care if you want to believe me or not but what you are suggesting is way out of line really. think what you want but im trying to get this thread on the topic of electrical grounding and other applications so i can learn.
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Old 09-08-2011, 11:21 PM   #55
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definitely not. i dont care if you want to believe me or not but what you are suggesting is way out of line really. think what you want but im trying to get this thread on the topic of electrical grounding and other applications so i can learn.
What are the basic differences between T250.66 and T250.122?

Are ground electrodes effective as parts of safety for personel? IOW what function do they serve?

GFCIs work how?
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Old 09-08-2011, 11:32 PM   #56
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Okay guys, lighten up. The OP's not on a pole with his Uncle's Kleins wanting to play sparky. There are no stupid questions, remember?

DM

If you are referring to me: I am out of line where?

OP says he wants to learn: This profession is not for the faint of heart. People die when mistakes are made, we are rough for a reason.
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Old 09-09-2011, 04:42 AM   #57
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i will find the answer to those questions later today, i have to go into work now and will be there for awhile but i will figure it out. and as far as the out of line goes..i actually appreciate someone showing me the so called "rough" way to explain things because that is all i have ever had to deal with when i worked for my uncle. he definitely made sure i knew if wasnt for the faint of heart. however there comes a point where it kind of seemed like it was intentional rather than for good reasoning, maybe it was the fact so many people were being that way but it could be viewed as being a little harsh. nevertheless before another debate occurs i dont care, im just glad that the thread has gone back to an actual relevant topic and id like it to stay there.
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Old 09-09-2011, 05:24 AM   #58
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Fair enough. Have a good day. Will talk to you later.

Bonus question: Explain, in normal terms, 250.32.
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Old 09-09-2011, 12:33 PM   #59
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The fact you worked on live circuits makes you unsafe.
I said something along those lines once to a lineman for the local power company. He almost hit me.

99.9% of everything they do is live. Of course, have you seen the hot gloves they wear!?


-- Joe
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Old 09-09-2011, 12:37 PM   #60
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Yep. Average is 4 years or 8000 hours minimum.
From start to masters license, 10,000 verified (with w2s) hours under a master here in NH.

4.84 years of full time work, plus exams, etc is about the fastest you can do it.

-- Joe

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