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Old 07-30-2010, 01:15 AM   #16
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I'd think motors have a generic exemption to GFCI protection because the normal capacitance from the motor windings to the motor shell [ground lead] causes several mA to flow.
Yoyizit.,

Are you bluffing on this one ?? just look at how many North Americian 120v motor work with GFCI and how many did trip ?? not very many what I know of Ditto with European verison as well.

So just don't come up with insane comment again please.

I did work on bunch of single and triphase motor that do run on RCD { GFCI } and under .5% did trip the GFCI due bad winding or just worn out insulating materals that about it.

It the same idea with old fridge compressor motours as well.


And just don't ask us to bend the NEC code or any other codes as well it not worth it.

Merci.
Marc

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Old 07-30-2010, 08:59 AM   #17
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Did the NEC give a rationale for removing this exemption?

In general, are the reasons for NEC decisions available anywhere on the Net?

Just curious. Very curious.
I'm always interested in learning more from a topic so I've taken some of the links and read the information.
In one link I found that it is the controller, not the motor, that was causing the GFCI tripping. This controller converted 120 single phase to 3 phase to run a big fan.
In another link, it was the outlet location, not the motor, that created the exemption:
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or install a dedicated non-GFCI receptacle in the wall in behind the fridge so that it is not "readily accessible". (readily accessible is the exception the Code makes for this)
Also, in the 2005 NEC (Code Check 4th ed) again, the location of the receptacle was the exemption: Receptacles that are not readily accessible OR single receptacles for appliances not easily moved.
So, garage door openers were not specifically exempt, the outlet they would be plugged into was exempt
NEC 2008 changed this so even the ceiling outlets have to be GFCI protected.
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Old 07-30-2010, 09:09 AM   #18
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And just don't ask us to bend the NEC code or any other codes as well it not worth it.

Merci.
Marc
Since the NEC causes a lot of arguments I have asked my attorney to petition the courts and have the NEC repealed.

Danke sehr. . .
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Old 07-30-2010, 09:40 AM   #19
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Since the NEC causes a lot of arguments I have asked my attorney to petition the courts and have the NEC repealed.

Danke sehr. . .
This is not a laughing matter. Regardless of the differences of interpretations of the NEC you would be willing to undo all that and risk life safety just to stop an argument?

Maybe we should have airbags banned due to the injuries or deaths they can cause while your at it?
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Old 07-30-2010, 08:33 PM   #20
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Since the NEC causes a lot of arguments I have asked my attorney to petition the courts and have the NEC repealed.

Danke sehr. . .
I know where this going and you can deal with edison era time and see how you can deal with it.

And I don't think you ever will get the NEC repealed at all it is too a big to stop in the track and we make it safer over the years do you want know who have more stricter code ?? The UK reguations is about the toughest one and will you understand the British standard {codes }??? .,,, I think ya will not get thru in first part at all.

I have talked to few UK electrician and they fill me in with their codes and Yoyizit .,, have fun try to depecher the UK codes.

Merci.
Marc
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Old 07-30-2010, 09:12 PM   #21
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and we make it safer over the years
Bologna.

The only thing that is done over the years is adding design and convenience issues as well as ways for the manufacturers who lobby the most to make more money.
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Old 07-30-2010, 09:39 PM   #22
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Bologna.

The only thing that is done over the years is adding design and convenience issues as well as ways for the manufacturers who lobby the most to make more money.
You must be talking about those $35.00 AFCI
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Old 07-30-2010, 09:45 PM   #23
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Bologna.

The only thing that is done over the years is adding design and convenience issues as well as ways for the manufacturers who lobby the most to make more money.
Kinda true but if you look back in large industrial area did you ever see old knife switches with live front??

I have see and I work on few of them.

But over the years someone will add new techongly and the code have to change along the way.

And not all from the manufacter do change the code some are from safety stand point of view that may have to do some change as well.

Merci.
Mar
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Old 07-30-2010, 09:59 PM   #24
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Problem with a dedicated outlet in the garage etc for a fridge/freezer - not readily accessible
....so the poerson moves....takes fridge/freezer with them
Now the outlet is readily available

Garage ...one circuit...you need more power
Maybe the door openers are on another circuit...so people run an extension cord up to use that circuit
...I know I would if I couldn't easily wire another circuit

GFCI's had problems when they 1st came out
Many people do not trust them still as a result
I have them in a lot of differeng places
...many due to my salt water aquarium

I have had problems with AFCI's already - with older lamps
Another AFCI breaker I had was recalled
I'm not sold on AFCI's yet as being dependable

But I run a large Christmas display w/GFCI's & one usually will only trip in the rain
....if a plug etc ends up in a puddle or under snow & wet/soaked
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Old 08-04-2012, 01:48 PM   #25
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Is their a big price difference between a chain drive versus a belt driven system?
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Old 08-04-2012, 04:18 PM   #26
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You must be talking about those $35.00 AFCI

But you agree GFCI's save lives right? How do you think the electricians felt at the time they first came out? Pretty impressive device I think at this time.

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