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Old 04-20-2012, 08:57 AM   #1
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Central Air Condenser Disconnect


Hello All,

I'm a DIY'er for most things except things that I want perfectly done and I know my limits. My brother is a licensed Master electrician but has really only dealt with Commercial last several years - his company are commercial electricians who setup new building contruction etc..
Anyway, my wife and I are getting Central Air from our tax money this year. That project starts in two weeks. My brother is going to tie everything together for me (electrical) but I had to do the research and buy everything. The HVAC installer said I need a 30A 2P GFI breaker to a 30A disconnect on the side of my house. I have the breaker specific to my panel, 10-2 wire and PVC conduit, etc.

Question:
I did purchase a 30A fusible pull-out disconnect box and 2x 30A NOS type H fuses. Will this work? The condenser is a new Trane XB13 and I can't find any documentation stating it needs fusible over non-fusible.

Thanks,
~S

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Old 04-20-2012, 09:03 AM   #2
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Central Air Condenser Disconnect


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Hello All,

I'm a DIY'er for most things except things that I want perfectly done and I know my limits. My brother is a licensed Master electrician but has really only dealt with Commercial last several years - his company are commercial electricians who setup new building contruction etc..
Anyway, my wife and I are getting Central Air from our tax money this year. That project starts in two weeks. My brother is going to tie everything together for me (electrical) but I had to do the research and buy everything. The HVAC installer said I need a 30A 2P GFI breaker to a 30A disconnect on the side of my house. I have the breaker specific to my panel, 10-2 wire and PVC conduit, etc.

Question:
I did purchase a 30A fusible pull-out disconnect box and 2x 30A NOS type H fuses. Will this work? The condenser is a new Trane XB13 and I can't find any documentation stating it needs fusible over non-fusible.

Thanks,
~S
Unless the manufacturer requires fuses, use a non-fused disconnect. GFI is not required and is not necessary. A GFI receptacle is needed within 25' of the unit for service.

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Last edited by electures; 04-20-2012 at 09:13 AM.
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Old 04-20-2012, 09:58 AM   #3
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Central Air Condenser Disconnect


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Unless the manufacturer requires fuses, use a non-fused disconnect. GFI is not required and is not necessary. A GFI receptacle is needed within 25' of the unit for service.
technically, the 25' receptacle doesn't need to be GFCI, only 'accessible'. for an outdoor unit though, 99.99% of the time that receptacle will be outside and thus need to be GFCI protected.
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Old 04-20-2012, 11:48 AM   #4
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Central Air Condenser Disconnect


What are the specs for the inside unit?

If you do not have the required receptale, then you will have to pull a circuit for that as well.
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Old 04-20-2012, 12:08 PM   #5
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Central Air Condenser Disconnect


Any master electrician regardless of expertise should know this answer and be able to help you through the complete installation process. Or if not familiar, should be able to consult a code book for every single answer.
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Old 04-20-2012, 12:34 PM   #6
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technically, the 25' receptacle doesn't need to be GFCI, only 'accessible'. for an outdoor unit though, 99.99% of the time that receptacle will be outside and thus need to be GFCI protected.
I was refering to the outside unit, and the 25" GFI receptacle. What 25' receptacle are you refering to?
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Old 04-20-2012, 12:51 PM   #7
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Central Air Condenser Disconnect


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I was refering to the outside unit, and the 25" GFI receptacle. What 25' receptacle are you refering to?
i was just commenting that 210.63 doesn't explicitly state that a service receptacle for air conditioners needs to be GFCI, as 210.63 doesn't differentiate between indoor and outdoor units. it only needs to be accessible which means for an outdoor unit, that receptacle is going to almost certainly have to be outside which now makes it have to be GFCI, per 210.8(A)(3).

this is more of a 'break the code' exercise than anything else. i mean, say that next to the outdoor air conditioner was an unlocked storage shed on stilts. this accessory building is not at grade so it could conceivably have a receptacle inside which is not GFCI protected yet is accessible and within 25' of the air conditioner. i know, i know, not a realistic scenario but it is possible. inspector would probably make you have a GFCI anyway.
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Old 04-20-2012, 01:33 PM   #8
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i was just commenting that 210.63 doesn't explicitly state that a service receptacle for air conditioners needs to be GFCI, as 210.63 doesn't differentiate between indoor and outdoor units. it only needs to be accessible which means for an outdoor unit, that receptacle is going to almost certainly have to be outside which now makes it have to be GFCI, per 210.8(A)(3).

this is more of a 'break the code' exercise than anything else. i mean, say that next to the outdoor air conditioner was an unlocked storage shed on stilts. this accessory building is not at grade so it could conceivably have a receptacle inside which is not GFCI protected yet is accessible and within 25' of the air conditioner. i know, i know, not a realistic scenario but it is possible. inspector would probably make you have a GFCI anyway.
Should be interesting to see what some of our "real expertz" have to say about this.
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Old 04-21-2012, 04:55 AM   #9
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Central Air Condenser Disconnect


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Originally Posted by electures View Post
Should be interesting to see what some of our "real expertz" have to say about this.
I would ask how a receptacle in a building on stilts/ not at grade complies with these parts of 210.63.

....shall be installed at an accessible.....

The receptacle shall be located on the same level.....

Accessible (as applied to equipment). Admitting close
approach; not guarded by locked doors, elevation, or other
effective means
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Old 04-21-2012, 06:29 AM   #10
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the answer to ur ? is yes ull b fine with what u have. ive had years in comm. and resid. so i understand ur relative not knowin much about wiring houses or troubleshooting them cuz they r a lot diff. in a lot of ways. not sure y ur goin pvc, if its gonna b visible id go with 3/4 emt it will look a lot cleaner (pvc never gets straight, plus over time it will bend with summer heat.) id probly bump my wire up to #8 thhn (romex if not piped the whole way, set a box if needed in attic to change to pipe cuz that romex is a lot more compared to single thhns. depending on how long u plan on livin there u might kick urself later if u ever get a larger unit that runs 40a and it all has to b re done.
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Old 04-21-2012, 06:37 AM   #11
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the answer to ur ? is yes ull b fine with what u have. ive had years in comm. and resid. so i understand ur relative not knowin much about wiring houses or troubleshooting them cuz they r a lot diff. in a lot of ways. not sure y ur goin pvc, if its gonna b visible id go with 3/4 emt it will look a lot cleaner (pvc never gets straight, plus over time it will bend with summer heat.) id probly bump my wire up to #8 thhn (romex if not piped the whole way, set a box if needed in attic to change to pipe cuz that romex is a lot more compared to single thhns. depending on how long u plan on livin there u might kick urself later if u ever get a larger unit that runs 40a and it all has to b re done.
Wow!
I don't know if you are on a phone or not, but this is impossible to read. I looks like a 13 year old girl wrote it.
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Old 04-21-2012, 06:37 AM   #12
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Any master electrician regardless of expertise should know this answer and be able to help you through the complete installation process. Or if not familiar, should be able to consult a code book for every single answer.
I completely agree.
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Old 04-21-2012, 08:04 AM   #13
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Central Air Condenser Disconnect


I agree any electrician should be able to do this, I am sure he has hooked up roof top units before and for the most part an air conditioner outside your house is like a roof top unit.
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Old 04-21-2012, 10:45 AM   #14
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Wow!
I don't know if you are on a phone or not, but this is impossible to read. I looks like a 13 year old girl wrote it.
I can decipher enough to know that he/she has no clue about 430/440 and sizing units.
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Old 04-21-2012, 11:07 AM   #15
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Wow!
I don't know if you are on a phone or not, but this is impossible to read. I looks like a 13 year old girl wrote it.
Oh come on, give em a break. They can't be expected to take that extra time away from partying to spell and punctuate.

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