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Old 02-12-2012, 12:01 PM   #61
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Ceiling Fan Problem, please help


Great news! I suck at following wires so I'll just watch.

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Old 02-12-2012, 12:05 PM   #62
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Where would you like to get power for the switch (s)? and would you like to have independent control of the fan and light? By this I mean do you wish to be able to control the light from a wall switch and the fan from a wall switch?

With your present set up you can power the fan and light from a single switch and control the fan and light from the pull chains.
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Old 02-12-2012, 12:06 PM   #63
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Great news! I suck at following wires so I'll just watch.

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ha thanks for your input though, i think i must have connected the wrong black or white that had power somehow to my 14/2.

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Old 02-12-2012, 12:34 PM   #64
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Where would you like to get power for the switch (s)? and would you like to have independent control of the fan and light? By this I mean do you wish to be able to control the light from a wall switch and the fan from a wall switch?

With your present set up you can power the fan and light from a single switch and control the fan and light from the pull chains.
i would like it so the when i turn the switch the light turns on. i would like the fan to only go on when i pull the chain.
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Old 02-12-2012, 12:46 PM   #65
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ha thanks for your input though, i think i must have connected the wrong black or white that had power somehow to my 14/2.
You will have much more confidence moving foward now.
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Old 02-12-2012, 01:16 PM   #66
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Ceiling Fan Problem, please help


i also found out that one black and white wire somehow are connected to the living room as when i turned off that breaker that outlet was off along with my living room outlet that has my tv.
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Old 02-12-2012, 01:24 PM   #67
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Ceiling Fan Problem, please help


Ok... As I understand things you want to get power to the switch and then on to the ceiling fan. The existing receptacle your wanting to get power from is switched with the switch you now want to use for the new fan correct?
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Old 02-12-2012, 02:09 PM   #68
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Essentially all your going to do is get a 14/2 G from the switch to the ceiling fan. Your going to replace the receptacle with one that does not have the tab broken off and connect all blacks together and pigtail to a brass screw on the receptacle. Same with the whites ... and connect to a silver screw ... you will no longer have a white connected with any black wires.

The fan/light/switch/receptacle part is shown in the drawing below. Your living room and tv will also get power...I just did not show that cable ... you can use termination points on the receptacle if you do not want to pigtail.

I haven't gone back and looked at your wiring and I don't remember any ground wires in the photos so we need to resolve that issue if it exists.
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Old 02-12-2012, 07:54 PM   #69
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i got it working!!! this is a great site and thank you for that last diagram, the only guestion i have is with the switch, should i run a ground to the box and wire that to the bare from the 14/2 from the fan and pigtail that onto the switch itself? thanks again for everyone that helped me out the past few days!!
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Old 02-12-2012, 08:07 PM   #70
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All the grounds need to be connected together and to the devices, also the box if metal.
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Old 02-12-2012, 08:09 PM   #71
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Jim

I don't see any equipment grounds in the original wiring ... can you double check?

The only egc I see is in the new cable at the fan.
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Old 02-12-2012, 08:31 PM   #72
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Jim

I don't see any equipment grounds in the original wiring ... can you double check?

The only egc I see is in the new cable at the fan.
the 3 places i have for ground and how they currently are wired...

switch=14/2 bare from fan is connected to switch but no ground to box

outlet= green wire from box to green screw on outlet

fan= 14/2 bare to fan green wire but no ground to box
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Old 02-12-2012, 08:59 PM   #73
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Unfortunately it does not appear you have and effective ground fault path back to your service panel at all. By this I mean you must have a equipment ground wire (bare wire in romex ..ie..nm-b cable) that is included in all the connecting cables that bonds any metal or device yokes all the way back to the service equipment panel.
The issue is if you develop a ground fault ( hot wire touching bare metal) then that metal will become energized at line voltage and becomes an electrocution and at minimum a shock hazard because a breaker cannot trip.

Sooooo in order to be code compliant you need to run an entire new cable (circuit) from the panel to the switch box and then cap off the wires coming from the receptacle at both ends. This will leave the receptacle powered and the cable between it and the switch box decommissioned.

At the switch box connect the bare equipment grounds in a wire nut and pigtail to the switch and metal box if it is metal.

Other wise you do not have protection from ground fault at the ceiling fans exposed metal that is code compliant.
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Old 02-12-2012, 09:13 PM   #74
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Unfortunately it does not appear you have and effective ground fault path back to your service panel at all. By this I mean you must have a equipment ground wire (bare wire in romex ..ie..nm-b cable) that is included in all the connecting cables that bonds any metal or device yokes all the way back to the service equipment panel.
The issue is if you develop a ground fault ( hot wire touching bare metal) then that metal will become energized at line voltage and becomes an electrocution and at minimum a shock hazard because a breaker cannot trip.

Sooooo in order to be code compliant you need to run an entire new cable (circuit) from the panel to the switch box and then cap off the wires coming from the receptacle at both ends. This will leave the receptacle powered and the cable between it and the switch box decommissioned.

At the switch box connect the bare equipment grounds in a wire nut and pigtail to the switch and metal box if it is metal.

Other wise you do not have protection from ground fault at the ceiling fans exposed metal that is code compliant.
great... i cant just run a ground off the switch box to the bare and switch? that wont work?
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Old 02-12-2012, 10:02 PM   #75
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great... i cant just run a ground off the switch box to the bare and switch? that wont work?
Nope, you need to understand that a fault path has to exist all the way back to the service panel. Essentially what this does is allow a ground fault to compete a circuit with the transformer. Otherwise no current will pass thru the protecting circuit breaker to force it to open and deenergize the metal.

Look at this diagram and I think you will understand what has to be in place. If the path shown by the red arrows is broken then the metal of the ceiling fan will be no different than a hot wire. The red arrows are following the bare equipment ground wires in the cables these wires are bonding all metal along the branch circuit so that a fault to that metal will carry to the equipment ground wires which bond to the neutral bar in the service equipment allowing the fault current to get back to the transformer. Since there is no load involved that limits amperage you will have massive amps flow on that fault circuit. Those amps must pass thru the circuit breaker which will cause it to open.
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