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Old 02-11-2012, 08:31 PM   #16
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Ceiling Fan Problem, please help


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Originally Posted by jhack836 View Post
there was no switch or outlet present at this time. i bypassed everything straight to the fan
and what happened?

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Old 02-11-2012, 09:00 PM   #17
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Ceiling Fan Problem, please help


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and what happened?
nothing happened at all! i pulled both chains, thats why im thinking it could be the fan or something maybe in the fan, just doesnt make sense to me
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Old 02-11-2012, 09:19 PM   #18
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Ceiling Fan Problem, please help


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i know i can pigtail the outlet so it is always hot, currently the switch has 1 black and 1 white that run to the outlet.....
Herein lies your problem:

You connected to existing black and white wires in a switch box, but did not rewire the outlet to make those wires a proper feed. In other words, you connected to a 2-wire switch loop, and as such it does not have a neutral wire in it.

You are measuring voltage at the fan, by measuring to ground, instead of between the white and black wires.


To correct the problem, you have to rewire the outlet by reconnecting all the black wires on the hot side of the receptacle (brass screws), and all the white wires on the neutral side (silver screws). In addition, if any of the break-away tabs have been removed, you will have to jumper those back together, or replace the outlet entirely.

This should make the old switch loop into a proper feed to the switch, and then your fan should work, providing your fan switch or control is wired properly (that means the white conductor is wire-nutted through, and not connected to the switch anymore).
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Old 02-11-2012, 09:22 PM   #19
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Ceiling Fan Problem, please help


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Herein lies your problem:

You connected to existing black and white wires in a switch box, but did not rewire the outlet to make those wires a proper feed. In other words, you connected to a 2-wire switch loop, and as such it does not have a neutral wire in it.

You are measuring voltage at the fan, by measuring to ground, instead of between the white and black wires.


To correct the problem, you have to rewire the outlet by reconnecting all the black wires on the hot side of the receptacle (brass screws), and all the white wires on the neutral side (silver screws). In addition, if any of the break-away tabs have been removed, you will have to jumper those back together, or replace the outlet entirely.

This should make the old switch loop into a proper feed to the switch, and then your fan should work, providing your fan switch or control is wired properly (that means the white conductor is wire-nutted through, and not connected to the switch anymore).
thanks thats kind of what i had in mind, but shouldnt the fan have worked though if i bypassed the switch and outlet? i bypassed everything just to make sure that it was in working condition before i finished everything.
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Old 02-11-2012, 09:34 PM   #20
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Ceiling Fan Problem, please help


Is the reversing switch on the fan stuck halfway?
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Old 02-11-2012, 11:42 PM   #21
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Ceiling Fan Problem, please help


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Is the reversing switch on the fan stuck halfway?
no, i tried it both ways, is there a way to see if the fan is faulty or something is wrong inside of the fan? it does seem weird light and fan dont work
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Old 02-11-2012, 11:58 PM   #22
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Ceiling Fan Problem, please help


Please describe in more detail how you "bypassed" the switch and outlet on this project. How about some pix?
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Old 02-12-2012, 12:16 AM   #23
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Ceiling Fan Problem, please help


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no, is there a way to see if the fan is faulty or something is wrong inside of the fan? it does seem weird light and fan dont work

yes, get a pigtail and a working light bulb and put it in place of the fan. when you get the light working, then remove it and replace with the fan.
I have an idea like some others here that you don't have a grounded conductor at the fan box.
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Old 02-12-2012, 06:14 AM   #24
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Ceiling Fan Problem, please help


jhack: in other posts you've said you ran 14-3 to the new ceiling box and in other posts you've said you have only connected black, white and ground at the ceiling box. If you ran 14-3, what is going on with the red conductor at the ceiling box?

As a note:
14-2 with ground has: black conductor, white conductor, bare ground
14-3 with ground has: black conductor, red conductor, white conductor, bare ground.


You really need to post some photos of the outlet, the connections you made at the outlet and the the conductors at the ceiling box. Without you doing this we are all going round and round and something may be getting loss in translation.
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Old 02-12-2012, 06:18 AM   #25
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Ceiling Fan Problem, please help


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yes, get a pigtail and a working light bulb and put it in place of the fan. when you get the light working, then remove it and replace with the fan.
In post #14 he said: i disconnected the outlet and wire nutted the black to black white to white and bare to green and ran that directly to the fan, i put the tested up there and it was showing power. there was no switch or outlet present at this time. i bypassed everything straight to the fan


was he testing power across the hot-neutral or hot-ground? We don't know.
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Old 02-12-2012, 09:10 AM   #26
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Ceiling Fan Problem, please help


it is a 14/2 wire, sorry. the 14/2 from the fan that i ran new is currently not ran to anything right now as i took the pics without it to show what i currently have. i also thought maybe someone could tell me how to run it then if i could just run it to the switch or just to the outlet, not both places if possible. i also did notice that the only ground i have connected in the fan box is the bare from the 14/2 and the green from the fan but they do ruun the green screw in the box. if you need more pics let me know, thanks for all the input


switch pic... has just 1 black and 1 white which are plugged into the back of the switch, the screws have nothing on them.


outlet pic.... thats what it looked like when i pulled it out of wall, if you need more pics or where they go to let me know. the tab on the right side where the screws are is broken so the switch would control half. there are 3 different spots in the box where wiring are coming from/going to.

fan pic....black to black and blue white to white bare to green. the other end of the wire is not connected at this moment so no power to it.
Attached Thumbnails
Ceiling Fan Problem, please help-img_1873.jpg   Ceiling Fan Problem, please help-img_1874.jpg   Ceiling Fan Problem, please help-img_1875.jpg   Ceiling Fan Problem, please help-img_1876.jpg   Ceiling Fan Problem, please help-img_1877.jpg  


Last edited by jhack836; 02-12-2012 at 09:16 AM.
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Old 02-12-2012, 09:38 AM   #27
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Ceiling Fan Problem, please help


You definitely have a switch loop at the rocker switch.
The white wire on the rocker switch is (most likely)supplying the power to the switch. The white wire at the switch should be taped black at both ends but doesn't affect functionality...just pointing it out. Also don't see a ground attached to the rocker switch. Is there a ground attached to the metal switch box?

The black wire at the switch is returning the power to the outlet when the switch is on.

On the photo below, are there only 2 wires under the wire nut circled? A white and a black wire?

Also with the white wire leaving that wire nut....I assume that is the other end of the white wire at the switch....which black wire...attached to the outlet...is paired with the white in the same cable? A or B on the outlet?
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Last edited by hammerlane; 02-12-2012 at 09:46 AM.
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Old 02-12-2012, 09:44 AM   #28
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Ceiling Fan Problem, please help


I just reread your other posts. You say the bottom half of the outlet is controlled by the switch so that would make black wire "B" leaving the box with the white wire under the wire nut correct?

Also looking more closely is the black wire at "A" just a pigtail from the wirenut. WHich would make three wires under that wirenut correct?
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Old 02-12-2012, 09:48 AM   #29
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Ceiling Fan Problem, please help


Quote:
Originally Posted by hammerlane View Post
You definitely have a switch loop at the rocker switch.
The white wire on the rocker switch is (most likely)supplying the power to the switch. The white wire at the switch should be taped black at both ends but doesn't affect functionality...just pointing it out.

The black wire at the switch is returning the power to the outlet when the switch is on.

On the photo below, are there only 2 wires under the wire nut circled? A white and a black wire?

Also with the white wire leaving that wire nut....I assume that is the other end of the white wire at the switch....which black wire...attached to the outlet...is paired with the white in the same cable? A or B on the outlet?

no there are 4 wires. 3 black and 1 white. the one that is B goes with the white up to the right. one black goes up to the left and the other black is connected to A
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Old 02-12-2012, 09:49 AM   #30
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Ceiling Fan Problem, please help


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Originally Posted by hammerlane View Post
I just reread your other posts. You say the bottom half of the outlet is controlled by the switch so that would make black wire "B" leaving the box with the white wire under the wire nut correct?

Also looking more closely is the black wire at "A" just a pigtail from the wirenut. WHich would make three wires under that wirenut correct?
you are correct with B and the white. yes technically there are 3 without that pigtail that goes to A

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