Can I Have GFCI Outlets On Same Circut As Normal Outlets? 12/2 - Electrical - Page 2 - DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum

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05-07-2013, 07:53 AM   #16
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by Philly Master NOT TRUE !!! Section 220-3(c)(6). The NEC does not have a specific rule that says 10 receptacles on a 15 ampere circuit or 13 receptacles on a 20 ampere circuit. For 15 ampere circuits, the calculation is as follows: 120 volts x 15 amperes = 1800 VA/180 VA = 10 receptacles, and for 20 ampere circuits, 120 volts x 20 amperes = 2400 VA/180 VA = 13 receptacles.
I would suggst you get a copy of Mike Holts book on calculations it will help clear up your confusion.

05-07-2013, 08:27 AM   #17
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by jbfan 220.14(J) Outlets specified in (J)(1),(2), and (3) are already included in the general lighting load of 220.12. No additional load calculations shall be required for such outlets. As many receptacles as you would like to have on a general use circuit in residential.
as someone else said this is to calculate the SERVICE Conductors and OCP of the service .... now that we have moved to the interior of the house we must now use calculations for the individual branch circuits ...

2000 sp ft house ... @ 3 va ....6000 va lights and oultets ....

use 15 amp circuits = 4 circuits (3.33) for all the outlets and all the lights ( general purpose )... ( 1800 va / 6000 va ) REALLY ??? LMAO

so IMHO ... this still stands on the "INDIVIDUAL BRANCH CIRCUIT"

[220.14(I)]. Except as covered by 220.14(J) and 220.14(E)—dwelling occupancies and banks/office buildings, respectively—the minimum is 180VA for each single or multiple receptacle in one yoke. But if a single piece of equipment consists of a multiple receptacle comprised of four (or more) receptacles (four example, a four-gang receptacle box or strip), then the minimum is 90VA per receptacle. This means, for example, you would allow 180VA for a duplex receptacle unit but 360VA for a four-gang receptacle unit.
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05-07-2013, 08:28 AM   #18
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by jbfan 220.14(J) Outlets specified in (J)(1),(2), and (3) are already included in the general lighting load of 220.12. No additional load calculations shall be required for such outlets. As many receptacles as you would like to have on a general use circuit in residential.
Yes LOAD but LOAD of WHAT ??? ie the SERVICE NOT the BRANCH CIRCUIT ...
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05-07-2013, 09:08 AM   #19
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by Philly Master NOT TRUE !!! Section 220-3(c)(6). The NEC does not have a specific rule that says 10 receptacles on a 15 ampere circuit or 13 receptacles on a 20 ampere circuit. For 15 ampere circuits, the calculation is as follows: 120 volts x 15 amperes = 1800 VA/180 VA = 10 receptacles, and for 20 ampere circuits, 120 volts x 20 amperes = 2400 VA/180 VA = 13 receptacles.
What version NEC are you getting this from? Does not exist in the 2011 NEC.

As for the number of receptacles on a circuit, there is no limit. The only requirement is;.

One 15A general lighting circuit for every 600 sq ft of living space, or

One 20A general lighting circuit for every 800 sq ft of living space.
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05-07-2013, 09:12 AM   #20
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by electures What version NEC are you getting this from? Does not exist in the 2011 NEC.

http://www.mikeholt.com/technical.ph...0through%20240
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05-07-2013, 09:39 AM   #21
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by AllanJ There are some restrictions on what branch circuits can serve what, but a circuit serving bedrooms may also serve an outide deck. Depending on the exact wiring, optionally one ground fault interrupter unit can serve both deck receptacles. To accomplish the latter, one of the outlet boxes must be downstream of the other in the usual daisy chain and also the circuit must not be a multiwire branch circuit typically using red and black hot wires sharing the neutral. Install the GFCI unit in the more upstream of the two outlet boxes and connect both black and white of the continuing cable to its "load" terminals instead of wire nutting pigtails to the "line" terminals.
Quote:
 Originally Posted by AllanJ In order to continue GFCI protection downstream from a GFCI receptacle (load terminals) on a MWBC that also continues, you need to run a separate 2 conductor cable for the protected subcircuit. You can have any number of separate GFCI units on the MWBC, connected via their line side terminals (subject only to the limit of total number of units or devices of all kinds). (rarely seen) When the MWBC breaks into two (non-MWBC) subcircuits at a box, you would need a third subcircuit for continuing the GFCI protection if you also want both halves of the MWBC to continue downstream without protection. The GFCI load side neutral and the line side neutral may not be bonded together (interconnected using any combination of wires or components). Same for the load side hot and any line side hot.

Thanks Allan..... I agree. I was just confused by what you meant in the first post.

Best Peter

05-07-2013, 09:45 AM   #22
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by Philly Master http://www.mikeholt.com/technical.ph...0through%20240
That is not NEC. It is from a practice exam.
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 05-07-2013, 06:47 PM #23 Licensed electrician   Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Maryland Posts: 10,433 Rewards Points: 1,020 The answer to the original question does not require any calculation to be done. __________________ Answers based on the National Electrical Code. Local amendments may apply. Check with your local building officials.
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05-07-2013, 07:17 PM   #24
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by electures That is not NEC. It is from a practice exam.

all the answers are from the NEC ....
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05-07-2013, 09:22 PM   #25
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by Philly Master Section 220-3(c)(6). The NEC does not have a specific rule that says 10 receptacles on a 15 ampere circuit or 13 receptacles on a 20 ampere circuit. For 15 ampere circuits, the calculation is as follows: 120 volts x 15 amperes = 1800 VA/180 VA = 10 receptacles, and for 20 ampere circuits, 120 volts x 20 amperes = 2400 VA/180 VA = 13 receptacles.
This is not a valid NEC section. It does not exist.

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Philly Master all the answers are from the NEC ....
Again, where?
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 05-07-2013, 09:55 PM #26 Sparky   Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Central Florida Posts: 706 Rewards Points: 510 the most current NEC that 220-3(c)(6) exists in was the 1996 edition. (6) Sign and outline lighting ............... 1200 volt-amperes for each required branch circuitspeciﬁed in Section 600-5(a).
05-07-2013, 10:21 PM   #27
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by Philly Master NOT TRUE !!! Section 220-3(c)(6). The NEC does not have a specific rule that says 10 receptacles on a 15 ampere circuit or 13 receptacles on a 20 ampere circuit. For 15 ampere circuits, the calculation is as follows: 120 volts x 15 amperes = 1800 VA/180 VA = 10 receptacles, and for 20 ampere circuits, 120 volts x 20 amperes = 2400 VA/180 VA = 13 receptacles.
Maybe in Canada or elsewhere, but not here in the U.S.. You could have a hundred outlets, or even a thousand outlets on a branch circuit, and you are not breaking any rules.

Just that you cannot plug in a hundred devices or a thousand devices into those outlets, unless they meet the 80% rule for amperage of the circuit, when all added together.

05-07-2013, 10:22 PM   #28
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by electures That is not NEC. It is from a practice exam.
:slam:

05-08-2013, 04:59 AM   #29
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by Philly Master NOT TRUE !!! Section 220-3(c)(6). The NEC does not have a specific rule that says 10 receptacles on a 15 ampere circuit or 13 receptacles on a 20 ampere circuit. For 15 ampere circuits, the calculation is as follows: 120 volts x 15 amperes = 1800 VA/180 VA = 10 receptacles, and for 20 ampere circuits, 120 volts x 20 amperes = 2400 VA/180 VA = 13 receptacles.
I didn't catch this until I saw it at least dozen times...

In this case, this code citation is absolutely true, although old lol...the NEC does NOT have a specific rule............

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05-08-2013, 08:41 AM   #30
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by electures This is not a valid NEC section. It does not exist. Again, where?
Most of it is in the 2008 NEC HANDBOOK or what some refer to as the illustrated guide page 116 ...now the link I provoed was more than likely from 2005 or older... But that is where the "exhibits" come from The NEC ....

It would NOT behoove Mr. Holt or anyone else to teach stuff not covered in the NEC for test taking purposes ...

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