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C. 1915 foreclosure = fun wiring project! (?)

4K views 30 replies 12 participants last post by  dmxtothemax 
#1 ·
Hello all!

Long time reader, first time poster - I'm a 24-year-old gal who grew up helping Dad renovate a Victorian house, now I'm married to a carpenter and we're moving from the tiny cabin we built in N. WI to a c. 1915 foreclosure fixer in North Carolina.

I've been doing a lot of reading and research about wiring in older houses (and the many generations of wiring types which may cohabit therein) but I have some specific questions about the wiring and service panels (3!) in our "new" 1,500 sq ft house. When we get down to NC we'll be bringing an electrician in to help us, but I want to get a good idea of what I'm talking about ahead of time so I know what is necessary and what is not when talking with an expert who may or may not encourage replacements where none are currently needed etc.

Q. 1: Fuse boxes - anyone out there still using yours? I understand they are safe as long as wiring is up to code and fuses are not overloaded. I've attached a photo of the main service panel (sorry it's sideways). Someone made off with the cover and fuse blocks when they stole the copper pipe out of the basement.

Q. 2: Any guesses how many amps this panel is? This system was in service within the last year, I'm just trying to determine whether this house is in dire need of an upgrade or not. We're hoping (and perhaps it's a vain hope?) that we can get the system up to code as is and then replace the service panels down the road.

Q. 3: There is a small 100 A breaker-style subpanel beside the main, which in turn feeds a 60 A fuse-type subpanel in an upstairs bedroom. Have you had experience with similar arrangements?

Q. 4: How old would you guess this wiring is? A lot appears to be newer/Romex, but I'm no expert!

Any info/pointers concerning old service panels would be appreciated!

Hilary
 

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#4 ·
In my area, I would have one shot at finding those missing pieces. But if I found them, they would cost me more than a new main breaker panel to replace the fuse box. (priced because they are hard to find)

Also based on wire size, I don't think you had more than 60 amps from the fuse box to the breaker panel (could have been less).
 
#8 ·
Hello all!

Long time reader, first time poster - I'm a 24-year-old gal who grew up helping Dad renovate a Victorian house, now I'm married to a carpenter and we're moving from the tiny cabin we built in N. WI to a c. 1915 foreclosure fixer in North Carolina.

I've been doing a lot of reading and research about wiring in older houses (and the many generations of wiring types which may cohabit therein) but I have some specific questions about the wiring and service panels (3!) in our "new" 1,500 sq ft house. When we get down to NC we'll be bringing an electrician in to help us, but I want to get a good idea of what I'm talking about ahead of time so I know what is necessary and what is not when talking with an expert who may or may not encourage replacements where none are currently needed etc.

Q. 1: Fuse boxes - anyone out there still using yours? I understand they are safe as long as wiring is up to code and fuses are not overloaded. I've attached a photo of the main service panel (sorry it's sideways). Someone made off with the cover and fuse blocks when they stole the copper pipe out of the basement.

Answer = Yes fuse box's are safe if in good condition and not over loaded,
But because there old technology you will have trouble getting parts for them. And insurance companies tend to prefer something more modern should you wish to insure your home.

Q. 2: Any guesses how many amps this panel is? This system was in service within the last year, I'm just trying to determine whether this house is in dire need of an upgrade or not. We're hoping (and perhaps it's a vain hope?) that we can get the system up to code as is and then replace the service panels down the road.

Answer =
It's not too big, 100A tops, you can get by on that, if your not too big on power use.

Q. 3: There is a small 100 A breaker-style subpanel beside the main, which in turn feeds a 60 A fuse-type subpanel in an upstairs bedroom. Have you had experience with similar arrangements?

Answer =
Sub panels are not unusual, especially where small main panels are found.

Q. 4: How old would you guess this wiring is? A lot appears to be newer/Romex, but I'm no expert!

Answer =

Bit hard to say for sure, need a better close up
some additions are evident
If you are concerned about the condition of the wiring get an electrician
to do a close up visual inpection of the wiring and a megger type test.
Does the wirings outer sheif look to be in good condition and not brittle ?

Any info/pointers concerning old service panels would be appreciated!

Hilary
Can you post a closer view ?
Especially the main supply lines ( bottom left corner )
 
#10 ·
The fastest, easiest, safest, and cheapest way to handle this is to replace the whole mess with a new panel. You're restoring and preserving the house as a whole, not the vintage electrical service.
 
#11 ·
I bought a house built in 1936 and in the 78 years since it was built it was a night mare, Plumbing, electrical and plaster, Tore everything out and redid it to existing code Why put all that money into a home and have it burn or flood trying to save a few bucks
 
#19 ·
And all you need to do is watch one come back out when it is plugged in. I saw two now and it is pretty impressive. somewhere I have a picture of the dent one left in the side of the PoCo truck door. The other landed about 25' away in the yard. Both had a pretty loud bang too. The PoCo guys around here are trained to not stand in front of them when racking them.
 
#13 ·
Ok op get a. Electrician. Is that more responsible.

As far as diy telling people how to install this and that. Measure and try this and that even on multi family and commercial buildings. then a person can get on his high horse and say something like that ???


Op don't pull the meter. Shop three numbers around and let an electrician do it.

And don't take any advice as it would irresponsible to even suggest you a diy er to work on it. You could hurt yourself and or die or start a fire and any suggestion by any one here for you to do the work would be irresponsible.
 
#17 ·
Wow....some of us a getting a bit touchy....

Semantics....depending on if your left or right inclined, one could take some of the above advice as meaning the OP 'physically' do it herself, or meaning 'have it done'.

I took it as 'have it done'. I think the OP made it pretty clear she was not in a position to do it herself.

So....to summarize the above.....

OP...hire someone to replace that mess. Anything less will be a waste of money.
 
#30 ·
Wow....some of us a getting a bit touchy....

Semantics....depending on if your left or right inclined, one could take some of the above advice as meaning the OP 'physically' do it herself, or meaning 'have it done'.

I took it as 'have it done'. I think the OP made it pretty clear she was not in a position to do it herself.

So....to summarize the above.....

OP...hire someone to replace that mess. Anything less will be a waste of money.


I think that they just want to understand what can and cannot be done
And I don't think that's unreasonable.
Some people just go crazy at any hint that they might do it them selves.
 
#18 ·
Well.... From your introduction and general family background and having the forsight to look into these issues and learn,, it sure sounds like you would know if you could DIY..... ( I'm not sure you could not learn and DIY....)

I'm not saying to DIY... I'm just saying that you sound competent enough to research it and make the decision yourself.

I would certainly advise that you have it inspected/permitted as "insurance"..... but clearly you are going to be better off just redoing it now/immediately, as your familys first project... ypu will save in the long run.

Good luck
 
#23 · (Edited)
Thanks for your insights - what I'm thinking at the moment is that we'll consult with and get quotes from several electricians. If they don't see any way to get the existing system up and running right away, we'll opt to have a professional replace the service panels right off the bat. As I mentioned in my first post we don't plan to tackle a service panel replacement on our own as novice electricians. This post is mostly an insight-finding mission - your opinions are greatly appreciated!
 
#24 · (Edited)
Meter looks to have been upgraded to 200 amp.
I think you are confusing ratings (max of what it COULD be used for), with what you have installed.

If the meter is 200 amp, that is fine. It means that you can upgrade without changing the meter base.

It is the wire size in the riser (wire from the place the wires attach to the house down to meter), and the wire size from the meter to your panel that set the actual sizing of your service. It is also a case of the weakest link sets the size.

If you wanted 200 amp service, you would probably have to increase the size of the wire in the riser. Often the larger size wire will also cause you to change out the riser conduit and the weather head.
 
#27 ·
I am not speaking directly to Dan's incidents.

Here is a pic of an open meter base where one of the jaws broke loose.
Look at the distance to the neutral. Or worse, it broke off and got pushed into the grounded case. Neither happened in this case.

But you could have had a line-neutral or line-ground fault. No overcurrent protection other than the transformer blowing or a wire melting.
 

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#31 ·
I am not speaking directly to Dan's incidents.

Here is a pic of an open meter base where one of the jaws broke loose.
Look at the distance to the neutral. Or worse, it broke off and got pushed into the grounded case. Neither happened in this case.

But you could have had a line-neutral or line-ground fault. No overcurrent protection other than the transformer blowing or a wire melting.


Is that the neutral in the middle ?
Geez it wouldn't have to move much
to cause utter kaos !
No wonder they explode !
:eek:
 
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