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Old 02-03-2008, 11:06 AM   #16
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


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How do I determine if the ground bar (there is only one bus bar used for both ground and neutral) is rated for 2 ground wires in the same hole?
MOST are. The conductors must be the same size.

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Old 02-03-2008, 11:38 AM   #17
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


there should be a sticker or a info sheet on the panel or its' cover that lists what size and quantity of wires allowed to be inserted in a hole or if the ground bar is a seperate one, they come with a sticker to be applied near the bar.

I have been chastized by an inspector before for multi (ground) wires in a terminal. He stated that typically a terminal accepting of multi wires is egg shaped, with the point down so as to apply equal pressure on the entire group of strands. Actually made sense to me. Rarely seen that in a ground bar though even when they were rated for mulitple wires though.

Oh, the other thing, a terminal must be rated for stranded or solid as well to accept either.

but as petey said, most ground bars are rated for multiple conductors.
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Old 02-03-2008, 01:01 PM   #18
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


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Oh, the other thing, a terminal must be rated for stranded or solid as well to accept either.
Nap - does this mean that an AFCI [stranded curly wire] can't be put in every panel box?
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Old 02-03-2008, 02:30 PM   #19
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


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Nap - does this mean that an AFCI [stranded curly wire] can't be put in every panel box?
No, it just means that the terminal must be rated for wahtever you put in it for it to be legal. Most terminals (that would be considered on this forum) are rated to accept stranded or solid wire.

In the real old days, panels may not have had terminals rated for stranded wire as it was not common, or even used, long ago. Techinically, stranded wire should not be used in those situations but I doubt it would be seen very often, if at all, by those that frequent this forum.

It was more a point of technicality than one to inhibit the work.
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Old 02-03-2008, 05:51 PM   #20
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


bp2 just leave then both in the hole my electrical occupations teacher at vo-tech told me about this and said nothing about the bar has to be rated for it. he has like 10 years experience in the field i doubt nap has any but i could be wrong. so nap don't flame me because i guessed wrong

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Old 02-03-2008, 06:16 PM   #21
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


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he has like 10 years experience in the field i doubt nap has any but i could be wrong. so nap don't flame me because i guessed wrong
Ooooh. He has a whole ten years?

Don't flame you? After that?
This is a pretty arrogant statement from someone in vo-tech.
I myself have probably nearly as much experience as you have years on this earth. I guarantee you Nap is no different.
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Old 02-03-2008, 06:39 PM   #22
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


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Ooooh. He has a whole ten years?

Don't flame you? After that?
This is a pretty arrogant statement from someone in vo-tech.
I myself have probably nearly as much experience as you have years on this earth. I guarantee you Nap is no different.
23 years in the business, and trumped by a vo-tech student
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Old 02-03-2008, 07:00 PM   #23
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


why are people such on this forum I was just telling you what i was told. If i was taught wrong you can cite some code to prove me wrong but instead you just wanna say that you are right and don't care to tell me where in the code is says that the bar must be rated for 2 grounds in the same hole.
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Old 02-03-2008, 07:11 PM   #24
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he has like 10 years experience in the field i doubt nap has any.....
Yeah, and we are the 's.
Who said anything about being right?
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Old 02-03-2008, 07:25 PM   #25
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


but you know i said that i could be wrong i mean this is a diy site not a professonal site so you know for all i know he could have been just a diy'er that knows nothing about the code now i know different. i was just trying to help the guy then some other people make it hard but still i want to know where it says that you cant put 2 grounds in the same hole unless the bar is rated for it.

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Old 02-03-2008, 07:36 PM   #26
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


110.14
(A) Terminals
Connection of conductors to terminal parts shall ensure a thoroughly good connection without damaging the conductors and shall be made by means of pressure connectors (including set-screw type), solder lugs, or splices to flexible leads. Connection by means of wire-binding screws or studs and nuts that have upturned lugs or the equivalent shall be permitted for 10 AWG or smaller conductors.
Terminals for more than one conductor and terminals used to connect aluminum shall be so identified.
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Old 02-03-2008, 07:36 PM   #27
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


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bu tyou know i said that i could be wrong i mean this is a diy site not a professonal so you know i was just trying to help the guy then some other people make it hard but still i want to know where it says that you cant put 2 grounds in the same hole unless the bar is rated for it.
Ok Pudge.

I don;t have experience. Ok. Won;t argue. makes no diff.

So, to your point; can you put 2 wires in any old hole.


NEC '05 110.14(A)

go tell your vo-tech teacher he is wrong and I would like an aplogy from him and you.
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Old 02-03-2008, 07:36 PM   #28
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damn you petey. I was typing
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Old 02-03-2008, 07:37 PM   #29
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


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23 years in the business, and trumped by a vo-tech student
I belive that would be game and match jbfan.
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Old 02-03-2008, 07:38 PM   #30
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


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but you know i said that i could be wrong i mean this is a diy site not a professonal site so you know for all i know he could have been just a diy'er that knows nothing about the code now i know different.
Yes, this IS a DIY site, but most of us who come here to answer questions are qualified electricians. If you had bothered to read a few threads before making that comment you would have realized that and this could have all been avoided.

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