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Old 02-02-2008, 01:28 PM   #1
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


Is is all right to run two ground wires through the same hole on a bus bar?

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Old 02-02-2008, 01:36 PM   #2
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


yes you can run 2 grounds in the same hole on a bus bar however you can't run a neutral and a ground together or 2 neutrals together.

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Old 02-02-2008, 02:37 PM   #3
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


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yes you can run 2 grounds in the same hole on a bus bar however you can't run a neutral and a ground together or 2 neutrals together.

Uh Oh....I am working on another project and was in my main today and who ever wired it (8 year old house) has the bare copper and the white (neutral?) in the same holes....Do I have a problem here???
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Old 02-02-2008, 03:05 PM   #4
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


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Originally Posted by Al the Diy guy View Post
Uh Oh....I am working on another project and was in my main today and who ever wired it (8 year old house) has the bare copper and the white (neutral?) in the same holes....Do I have a problem here???
under new code yes 8 years ago I'm not sure since I wasn't working in the field but probably I would put them in their own holes.

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Old 02-02-2008, 05:26 PM   #5
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


Pudge, yea, it doesn't make sense not to, that was wierd seeing that, the ground bus (attached to the BIG green wire) is on the right and the neutral bus is on the left but whoever did it ran both the neutral and grounds into the same holes either on the left or right as the cables entered the box...Crazy...I have a county inspector coming out tuesday for a pool electrical inspection, I will show him and let you guys know what he says...perhaps I should take a pic?
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Old 02-02-2008, 06:46 PM   #6
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


Pudge, I'm not doubting your answer, but since everything is connected on the bus bar, I would love to know the thinking behind:
1) It's OK to double up w/ two ground wires
2) It's not OK to double up two neutral wires or a ground and a neutral.
Thanks,
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Old 02-02-2008, 07:07 PM   #7
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


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I would love to know the thinking behind:
1) It's OK to double up w/ two ground wires
2) It's not OK to double up two neutral wires or a ground and a neutral.
The reason being is that the grounds are not current carrying conductors under normal conditions. Neutrals carry current.

'08 code changes it anyway...
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Old 02-02-2008, 07:22 PM   #8
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


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The reason being is that the grounds are not current carrying conductors under normal conditions. Neutrals carry current.

'08 code changes it anyway...

Junkcollector, what do the 08 codes say about this, (must be seperated, would be my guess)
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Old 02-02-2008, 09:13 PM   #9
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


hey al don't get confused between haveing grounds and neutrals on the same bus in a MAIN panel to having grounds and neutrals in the same hole. the reason being is that main panels have the neutral and ground bars bonded. Unless you have a main disconect between the meter and main panel then grounds and neutrals must be isolated from each other. bp2 to answer your question I don't know the reason behind it but its in the NEC so its just "law" and from what my tech teacher tells me there is an eception. if the panel has oval holes in the bus bar 2 neutrals can be put in it my teachers theory is that its because with the oval one the screw will push it against the side of the hole thus making a tighter connection.

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Old 02-02-2008, 09:53 PM   #10
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


Thanks Pudge....was worried
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Old 02-02-2008, 10:01 PM   #11
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


You cannot put 2 neutrals in the same hole. You can put 2 grounds EGC in the same hole IF the ground bar is rated to have 2 wires in the same hole.

If it is not rated as such, it is illegal.

junkcollector; what is the code section regarding the change?

Last edited by nap; 02-02-2008 at 10:04 PM.
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Old 02-02-2008, 10:16 PM   #12
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


Part of the reason you cannot terminate two neutrals in one hole is because if, during the course of service, one of the neutrals needs to be removed and the other accidentally comes off...open neutral. I'm here to tell you it's a BAD thing. If it is the neutral for a MWBC, all appliances will go 220. If you happen to grab the neutral you will get whacked something fierce.
I got nailed on one at my buddy's place and I had to convince my arm that we needed to let go. Even had to do a backward count in my head. When I got off of it, my buddy says: "You were humming" I told him "I always thought that noise was in my head."

Bottom line: Code says land one per hole. Panel manufacturers say land one per hole. There isn't much reason you should need to run two in a hole.
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Old 02-02-2008, 10:33 PM   #13
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


EGC?
MWBC?
Is there a problem with using a short piece of wire and a wire nut to extend the length of a ground wire to reach a spare hole?
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Old 02-03-2008, 12:20 AM   #14
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


egc- equipment grounding conductor i.e. ground

mwbc- multiwire branch circuit- where two hots (in a resi situaiotn) share a neutral.


generally not a problem extending the wire although I have had inspectors look down their noses at such work. I know of no code violation but they always seem to think there is one.
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Old 02-03-2008, 08:39 AM   #15
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bus bar - 2 in a hole


OK – Pudge says that I can put 2 grounds in the same hole.
Nap says that 2 ground wires can be in the same hole IF the ground bar is rated for it.

How do I determine if the ground bar (there is only one bus bar used for both ground and neutral) is rated for 2 ground wires in the same hole?

Would it be better to add a small length of wire to the ground wire so that it can have it’s own hole or leave the two ground wires in the same hole as it is now? I really don’t want to reorganize the whole bus bar to free up a hole within reach of the second ground wire.

Thanks,
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