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Old 08-01-2013, 05:57 PM   #16
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Box Notched Over Ceiling Grid


Quote:
Originally Posted by sparks1up
Did nobody see kbsparky's post above? I was going to post the same thing! If you use a box designed for the purpose and install it properly it is perfectly legal and safe. I have used those boxes in acoustic ceilings many times and never failed an inspection!
The specs on the page says "recommended for low voltage applications only" under special feature.
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Last edited by leungw; 08-01-2013 at 06:01 PM.
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Old 08-01-2013, 06:04 PM   #17
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Box Notched Over Ceiling Grid


If you go to the manufacturers specs it say they are for ceiling lights and fans! Click on the "product details" tab

What they mean by "low voltage" in this case is 120-volts. Not 277 volts...
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Old 08-01-2013, 07:28 PM   #18
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Box Notched Over Ceiling Grid


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Originally Posted by sparks1up View Post
If you go to the manufacturers specs it say they are for ceiling lights and fans! Click on the "product details" tab

What they mean by "low voltage" in this case is 120-volts. Not 277 volts...
You passed inspections using them for 120 volts?
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Old 08-01-2013, 07:34 PM   #19
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Box Notched Over Ceiling Grid


Really can't see how 120v can be considered low voltage.
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Old 08-01-2013, 08:16 PM   #20
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Box Notched Over Ceiling Grid


Just a newbie here but this video seems pretty good! He gives examples (2 different times in the video) of what he calls low voltage applications- but those voltages weren't familiar to me, but would probably mean something to you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4lpiQye3A8E

Last edited by agoodboy; 08-01-2013 at 08:21 PM.
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Old 08-01-2013, 09:00 PM   #21
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Box Notched Over Ceiling Grid


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Originally Posted by agoodboy View Post
Just a newbie here but this video seems pretty good! He gives examples (2 different times in the video) of what he calls low voltage applications- but those voltages weren't familiar to me, but would probably mean something to you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4lpiQye3A8E
Examples he gave: security camera, alarm, speaker, etc.
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Old 08-01-2013, 09:00 PM   #22
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Box Notched Over Ceiling Grid


Quote:
Originally Posted by OhioDon View Post
You passed inspections using them for 120 volts?
Yes I have!
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Old 08-01-2013, 09:02 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by ToolSeeker View Post
Really can't see how 120v can be considered low voltage.


For the record these boxes would be fine for 277-volt lighting applications as well!

Low voltage in electrical as defined by the NEC is under 600-volts nominal. Above 600-volts is considered high voltage.

Why do you see a problem with them? They are made specifically for installation on an acoustic ceiling grid! Boxes are not rated for any specific voltage. It is the device or the fixture you install in or on the box that is rated for a specific voltage! Not the box! Even if you install the box in the center of a tile it still has a metal bracket connecting it to the grid. But as long as it is grounded properly it's not a problem. Even lay-in fluorescent fixtures are attached to the grid. Why is this any different?

Because the wires can touch the grid? If the box or fixture is connected to the grid and grounded properly any short circuit will go to ground and trip the breaker/blow the fuse....

If not grounded properly it could energize the box, fixture and ceiling grid and anything metallic connected. But the same thing applies to a fixture installed in the grid... Do it right and there is no problem!
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Last edited by sparks1up; 08-01-2013 at 09:25 PM. Reason: Clarity
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Old 08-01-2013, 09:09 PM   #24
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Box Notched Over Ceiling Grid


On the product page, under product details:
Application: These octagon boxes are used to install ceiling and wall lighting fixtures, fans, convenience junction boxes and devices. Don't believe I've ever seen a low voltage fan! And, I would say low voltage wall lighting fixtures are pretty rare.

Also, when they say Recommended for low-voltage applications only you would think the wording would be a bit more definitive such as "Not approved for non-low voltage applications" if they really don't want us using this for 120 volts.?????
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Old 08-01-2013, 10:20 PM   #25
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Box Notched Over Ceiling Grid


Quote:
Originally Posted by sparks1up View Post
...

Low voltage in electrical as defined by the NEC is under 600-volts nominal. Above 600-volts is considered high voltage.


...
That statement confused an electrical newbie like me (easy to do lol) . I have an old copy of the NEC and I didnít remember the definition you refer to. I found this statement online that may shed some light on the topic. But you and some of the gurus here may not agree with it:

Quote:
What is A Low Voltage Circuit?

The NEC does not consistently define low voltages. In 110.26(A)(1)(b), voltages of not greater than 30 volts ac rms and 60 volts dc are the dividing line. Article 720 is titled "Circuits and Equipment Operating at less than 50 volts." Article 725 uses tables which list voltages from 0 through 150 volts ac and dc. Other Sections of the Code are divided based on whether or not the voltage is less than or equal to 600 volts or over 600 volts. Still other sections use 150 and 250 volts as the dividing line. "Low voltage circuit" just like "low voltage work" are slang terms that do not have precise definitions but are commonly used to describe what most electricians think of as work with voltages under 50 volts and using No. 16, No. 18 and smaller wire sizes.
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Old 08-02-2013, 03:59 AM   #26
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Box Notched Over Ceiling Grid


Progress Lighting also has a ceiling box with T-bar slots:

P8770-01

I have installed this box exactly one time in my 35+ years of electrical contracting.
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Last edited by kbsparky; 08-03-2013 at 02:48 AM. Reason: Correction of grammatical error
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Old 08-02-2013, 02:54 PM   #27
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See these instructions: http://progresslighting.com/InstallSheets/023077_A.pdf I assume the "supply wires" they show are 120 volts?
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Old 08-03-2013, 02:49 AM   #28
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Exactly right. 120 Volts.

This discussion has turned into trying to make a mountain out of a molehill.
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