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Old 11-08-2013, 04:03 PM   #1
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Baseboard Heater Circuit Design


I am designing the circuit(s) for my basement apartment (cca. 800 sq ft) baseboard heating solution. I am planning to buy Berko HBB Series heaters and distribute them as shown in the below table. All have a voltage of 240/208.

Code:
Location        Model       Length(in.) Watts       Amps
-----------------------------------------------------------     
Living Room     HBB1504     70          1500/1125   6.3/5.8             
Bath            HBB504      28          500/375     2.1/1.8             
Bedroom         HBB1254     58          1250/938    5.2/4.5             
Hallway         HBB754      34          750/563     3.1/2.7
My questions are:
1. Should I split them into two circuits (living room and bathroom in one, bedroom and hallway in the other) or is it OK to keep them all on one circuit?

2. Is the voltage a factor in determining the wire gauge? I know that the amperage is. E.g. if I split them in two circuits so that each circuit bears less than 10A each, can I go with AWG 14/3 even though the voltage is double than usual? Or simply put, which AWG should I use for either scenario from question 1.?
I have an extensive experience as a DIY electrician, I have pretty much rewired most of my house and have set up one 240/120 circuit for my dryer (used AWG 10/3). But this is considerably lower amperage so I am not sure what AWG to use.

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Old 11-08-2013, 04:43 PM   #2
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Baseboard Heater Circuit Design


Quote:
Originally Posted by amakarevic View Post
I am designing the circuit(s) for my basement apartment (cca. 800 sq ft) baseboard heating solution. I am planning to buy Berko HBB Series heaters and distribute them as shown in the below table. All have a voltage of 240/208.

Code:
Location        Model       Length(in.) Watts       Amps
-----------------------------------------------------------     
Living Room     HBB1504     70          1500/1125   6.3/5.8             
Bath            HBB504      28          500/375     2.1/1.8             
Bedroom         HBB1254     58          1250/938    5.2/4.5             
Hallway         HBB754      34          750/563     3.1/2.7
My questions are:
1. Should I split them into two circuits (living room and bathroom in one, bedroom and hallway in the other) or is it OK to keep them all on one circuit?

2. Is the voltage a factor in determining the wire gauge? I know that the amperage is. E.g. if I split them in two circuits so that each circuit bears less than 10A each, can I go with AWG 14/3 even though the voltage is double than usual? Or simply put, which AWG should I use for either scenario from question 1.?
I have an extensive experience as a DIY electrician, I have pretty much rewired most of my house and have set up one 240/120 circuit for my dryer (used AWG 10/3). But this is considerably lower amperage so I am not sure what AWG to use.
14/2 on a 2 pole 15 amp breaker for each pair of heaters.

I almost would be tempted to put them all on a 20 amp circuit and 12/2 wire.

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Old 11-08-2013, 04:50 PM   #3
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Baseboard Heater Circuit Design


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14/2 on a 2 pole 15 amp breaker for each pair of heaters.
Doesn't dual voltage require two hots?
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Old 11-08-2013, 04:52 PM   #4
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Baseboard Heater Circuit Design


Warm weather areas can get away with the one circuit.
Cold weather makes 2 circuits much more desirable. One problem won't take out all the heat.
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Old 11-08-2013, 05:00 PM   #5
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Cold weather makes 2 circuits much more desirable. One problem won't take out all the heat.
Well if I am home, I flip the breaker back on. If I am away, who cares if it is colder?
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Old 11-08-2013, 05:31 PM   #6
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Baseboard Heater Circuit Design


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Originally Posted by amakarevic View Post
Doesn't dual voltage require two hots?
The 240 requires 2 hots, but does not require a neutral.
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Old 11-08-2013, 05:41 PM   #7
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Baseboard Heater Circuit Design


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Originally Posted by jbfan View Post
The 240 requires 2 hots, but does not require a neutral.
Hmmm. That sure is interesting. Never seen anything that "does not require a neutral". I trust you but can you please explain this phenomenon so it makes sense to me?

Thanks
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Old 11-08-2013, 05:57 PM   #8
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Baseboard Heater Circuit Design


I generally use 10 watts per sq. ft. with a 8 ft. ceiling, Thats how I size the required amount of electric heat required, now with that said, using 15 amp breakers you are allowed 11' of electric heat @ 250 watts per ft, and 15' of electric heat at 20 amps, those numbers are the deciding factor when laying out electric heat, I also use heat relays and low voltage t-stats because I like them in my opinion…

you are already over 16 amps, and electric heat is considered a continuous load, you need 2 circuits…..either 15 or 20 amps….

Last edited by stickboy1375; 11-08-2013 at 07:32 PM.
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Old 11-08-2013, 05:59 PM   #9
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Baseboard Heater Circuit Design


Quote:
Originally Posted by amakarevic View Post
Hmmm. That sure is interesting. Never seen anything that "does not require a neutral". I trust you but can you please explain this phenomenon so it makes sense to me?

Thanks
Not every appliance requires a grounded conductor (neutral), a electric water heater or AC unit is a perfect example…
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Old 11-08-2013, 06:02 PM   #10
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Baseboard Heater Circuit Design


Quote:
Originally Posted by jbfan View Post

I almost would be tempted to put them all on a 20 amp circuit and 12/2 wire.
Impossible, over 80% of a 20 amp circuit…..
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Old 11-08-2013, 08:36 PM   #11
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Baseboard Heater Circuit Design


Quote:
Originally Posted by amakarevic View Post
I am designing the circuit(s)
for my basement apartment (cca. 800 sq ft) baseboard heating solution.
Your space (880SF x 7ft ceiling) = 6160 watts total
You don't have enough heaters.
Get another 2000 watts worth.

That (6000/240) is AT LEAST two 20A 240V circuits.

I'd suggest running those circuits through a relay
with a 24V coil... and using a 24V set back thermostat
(and of course a 24V transformer too).

Last edited by TarheelTerp; 11-08-2013 at 08:39 PM.
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Old 11-08-2013, 08:44 PM   #12
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Baseboard Heater Circuit Design


Quote:
Originally Posted by TarheelTerp View Post

I'd suggest running those circuits through a relay
with a 24V coil... and using a 24V set back thermostat
(and of course a 24V transformer too).
They make electric heat relays with built in transformers…..


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Old 11-11-2013, 09:59 AM   #13
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Baseboard Heater Circuit Design


why would i need a relay? and where would i install it? the elec. panel?

Last edited by amakarevic; 11-11-2013 at 10:17 AM.
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Old 11-11-2013, 10:23 AM   #14
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Baseboard Heater Circuit Design


Quote:
Originally Posted by amakarevic View Post
Doesn't dual voltage require two hots?
you don't need to run 120 and 240 to the heaters. you can use either voltage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by amakarevic View Post
why would i need a relay? and where would i install it? the elec. panel?
you don't necessarily need a relay. if you get a thermostat rated for line voltage and the amperage of the circuit, you wouldn't need a separate relay. berko makes line-rated thermostats, check out their website.
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Old 11-11-2013, 03:03 PM   #15
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Baseboard Heater Circuit Design


Quote:
Originally Posted by amakarevic View Post
why would i need a relay?
There are more options available with 24V thermostats.
Put the entire space under one control.
The relay will handle the load.

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