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Old 12-11-2007, 09:54 PM   #31
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Anyone want to take a shot at why #6 to attach antenna ground to breaker?


Hell, Stubbie! She invited you over for Christmas!

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Old 12-11-2007, 10:09 PM   #32
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Anyone want to take a shot at why #6 to attach antenna ground to breaker?


You can't hardly blame her....
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Old 12-11-2007, 10:18 PM   #33
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Anyone want to take a shot at why #6 to attach antenna ground to breaker?


Allow me to clarify. If lightning is close and voltage builds up on the EGCs and the metal parts they are bonded to MOST of the voltage will bleed out on the GEC with the lowest resistance. The ufer and the pipe(if available) will successfully bleed out ALL of the induced voltage without the need of the voodoo 25 or 250 or 2500 ohm rods. They just aren't a reliable, consistent ground. They are code, though. Don't see them going away. I try to get in my happy place when I don't have a big ass hammer drill and I'm driving two rods right next to Stone Mountain, which is a big ole chunk of granite NE of ATL.

As always, in the event of a direct strike, all bets are off.

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Old 12-12-2007, 02:24 PM   #34
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Anyone want to take a shot at why #6 to attach antenna ground to breaker?


I'm a little nervous about my grounding rods after what I just went through. My antenna came with a 4', brought the 5lb hammer and started pushing the rod into the ground with my bare hands and it went 5' deep by just the force of my index finger. I thought maybe the thing wasn't solid pulled it out really easily, it is. Didn't feel that was any good, but pushed it down with my index finger in another spot the 5'. Then, purchased an 8', and tried all over the place and everywhere was able to push it down 7' easily with the palm of my hand then hit ledge. So... what do you think... sink hole? Previous owners bury organic matter? Or, does dirt have the consistency of dry peat moss come winter?

What's wrong with the panel? It's the example used in a book on keeping code so, be pretty dumb if it's not up to par. Got the image at

http://www.dummies.com/WileyCDA/Dumm...e/id-4797.html

Last edited by Piedmont; 12-12-2007 at 02:29 PM.
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Old 12-12-2007, 03:03 PM   #35
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Anyone want to take a shot at why #6 to attach antenna ground to breaker?


There really isn't anything that bad with the panel. The red - black alternation on those afci breakers made us think that they had them on multiwires with a shared neutral which won't work. What I really think is going on is that the cables are not 14/3 G but 14 2/2 G. This style cable gives each hot conductor it's own neutral.

The clamps are not nm-b clamps to my knowledge they look like ent connectors (smurf tube). So the panel is fine other than that one very small issue.

I hope your house foundation is set on that ledge because it sounds like you are surrounded by fill dirt that wasn't compacted by the dozer. the 4 foot rod was really a iffy deal and as mentioned before it is merely a supplemental rod to serve that antenna but a lot is been said now days as to that being a waste of time. If had been me I would have pitched it and got an 8 footer and drove it and that would be my second rod for the main panel ges system. then I would have put my antenna ground to it. Anyway forget the 4 foot rod and get an 8 footer.
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Old 12-12-2007, 03:08 PM   #36
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Anyone want to take a shot at why #6 to attach antenna ground to breaker?


Piedmont,

Assuming you have other Grounding Electrode Conductors in code compliant contact with earth, I wouldn't worry.

Last edited by Andy in ATL; 12-12-2007 at 05:35 PM. Reason: removal of idiotic statement and wrong quote...doh!
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Old 12-12-2007, 04:03 PM   #37
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Anyone want to take a shot at why #6 to attach antenna ground to breaker?


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Originally Posted by Stubbie View Post
The clamps are not nm-b clamps to my knowledge they look like ent connectors (smurf tube).
Stubbie. Those are actually NM connectors. They are the blue version of this:
http://electrical.hardwarestore.com/...or-647820.aspx


I'm not sure how many cables they are rated for though.
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Old 12-12-2007, 04:09 PM   #38
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Anyone want to take a shot at why #6 to attach antenna ground to breaker?


They are expensive suckers.

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Old 12-12-2007, 04:19 PM   #39
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Anyone want to take a shot at why #6 to attach antenna ground to breaker?


I sorta thought they might be but I've never seen the blue ones only the gray ones. I've never seen any that would take so many cables that one looks like it has at lest nine 12/2's thru it. Unless there is one in behind it that just makes it look that way.

Last edited by Stubbie; 12-12-2007 at 04:21 PM.
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Old 12-12-2007, 08:42 PM   #40
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Anyone want to take a shot at why #6 to attach antenna ground to breaker?


I always got the blue ones till the past year and now I only find grays's. I dont know why but I see "Ideal" in my mind on the blue guys. I have only seen singles and doubles, which doesnt mean squat since I seldom use em and never go past 2's. I just use more of em :} If I do
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Old 01-07-2008, 08:38 PM   #41
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Anyone want to take a shot at why #6 to attach antenna ground to breaker?


What about people like myself who have no public water system to ground to.. but a well water system instead? Is a single ground rod enough?

Piedmont, what's the make/model of the antenna, and where did you get it from? I want to get a nice HD antenna... don't think I want to spend $450 though. I can't find any retailers that carry any decent antennas locally....
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Old 01-08-2008, 05:55 AM   #42
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Anyone want to take a shot at why #6 to attach antenna ground to breaker?


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What about people like myself who have no public water system to ground to.. but a well water system instead? Is a single ground rod enough?
In this case most inspectors will require two ground rods.
Even with a water pipe electrode some inspectors still require two.
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Old 01-08-2008, 09:56 AM   #43
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Anyone want to take a shot at why #6 to attach antenna ground to breaker?


Much of my expense can probably be avoided. I live 60-75 miles away from three big cities in mountains, trees, and a wet climate. Everything told me I need big outside antenna with motor. If you live near a major city a small antenna will do and wouldn't need a rotor. If you live in a dry climate, you could get away with an attic antenna which doesn't require grounding. Attic antenna wasn't for me, moisture kills signal so if you live in an area where rain & water frequently cover your roof, or accumulates dew or snow for extended periods of time an attic antenna is not going to work.

I ended up getting the

Antenna: Winegard 7084p $109
Pre-Amp: Channel Master 7777 $59
Eave mount bracket: $22
Eagle Aspen Rotor: $69 (it's a rotator with a remote)
duel-grounding coax grounding block: $1.99
8' long, 1 5/8" diam galvanized fence post and used it for a mast $8
75 ft of #6, 40 ft of #10, ground rod, 2 acorn clamps for around $115

Red stuff online at www.starkelectronic.com, blue at www.solidsignal.com, purple at local Home Depot. That's the basics, you also need coax tools, coax cable (with the Eagle Aspen rotor that means solid copper core coax, not copper coated steel), clamps, etc. But, if you live near a big city, you don't need a pre-amp, don't need a rotor, don't need solid copper core coax, don't need a big antenna, and probably can rent or know someone with coax stripping & crimping tools (I paid $35 for mine) and can probably be done for $200 or less. If you give your zip code I can give you an estimate, I'll then be able to look up what direction, power, and miles away the broadcast towers are. I didn't understand the grounding issue with having a well pump. You have to purchase a grounding rod ($8), and attach the antenna with #10 to it along with a #6 wire from that rod to your breaker panel, not plumbing. They don't allow you to ground to plumbing unless within 5' of the line coming in city or well (and that plumbing needs to be metal), my guess much of todays plumbing is currently PEX or plastic or repaired with it so not usually accepted as a ground. Your breaker panel is the one that already usually has a bonding to your water supply within 5' of entrance if it's not plastic, and usually has 1 or 2 grounding rods itself. I did hear you can run the #6 wire from your antenna's grounding rod and attach it to one of your breaker panels grounding rods if that's easier, and the #6 wire to your breaker panel or rods can be run either inside or outside, can be bare or coated... whichever is easier/cheaper. Since my antenna was on the opposite side of my breaker panel and I had to zig-zag it through my house I ended up needing about 75 feet of #6 when all was said and done.

Last edited by Piedmont; 01-08-2008 at 10:33 AM.
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Old 01-08-2008, 10:27 AM   #44
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Anyone want to take a shot at why #6 to attach antenna ground to breaker?


... Edited this, was double post of above ...

Last edited by Piedmont; 01-08-2008 at 12:41 PM.
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Old 01-08-2008, 04:11 PM   #45
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Anyone want to take a shot at why #6 to attach antenna ground to breaker?


I think that is great, piedmont. I think the ground wire SHOULD be run from the antenna to the rods for your electrical system. It is the additional ground rod that I don't like.

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