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Old 12-05-2009, 11:20 AM   #31
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900W and up trips breaker, Circuit draws power even with everything off...


The guts of the offending GFCI

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Old 12-05-2009, 11:21 AM   #32
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900W and up trips breaker, Circuit draws power even with everything off...


With circuit 18 off you still have power to the cord going to the septic pump?
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Old 12-05-2009, 11:23 AM   #33
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900W and up trips breaker, Circuit draws power even with everything off...


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Originally Posted by Jim Port View Post
Breakers do not trip exactly at the amp rating, ie a 15 does not trip at 15.01 nor 15.25. They will hold above the rating for a period of time depending on the amount of overage. The greater the overage the quicker the trip, 40 amps very quickly, 16 will probably hold for an hour or more. All this is determined by the manufacturers trip curves.
http://www.google.com/search?client=...UTF-8&oe=UTF-8
"15" means 14.5 to 15.4. It is a nominal, vs actual, value, just like a 2x4 is not 2.0 x 4.0.

"15.0" means 14.95 to 15.04.

We're not looking here for a few errant milliwatts. This fault is pretty large. We don't need precision.

Last edited by Yoyizit; 12-05-2009 at 11:41 AM.
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Old 12-05-2009, 11:31 AM   #34
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900W and up trips breaker, Circuit draws power even with everything off...


jim, you're a genius (or im just really...not). that GFCI does connect to the outdoor outlet that i am running the extension cord out to my septic pump. this explains everything i think. themystery draw is from the 1 hp pump, and maybe explains the tripping. pump plus 900W heater = overload.
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Old 12-05-2009, 11:37 AM   #35
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900W and up trips breaker, Circuit draws power even with everything off...


OK, now that the problem has been found...

The way to solve this is to add a new circuit or two to "offload" that circuit.

So maybe install a new separate circuit for the outside pump?
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Old 12-05-2009, 11:42 AM   #36
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900W and up trips breaker, Circuit draws power even with everything off...


Billy Bob - U R correct. The plan has always been to dig a new trench (150') and upgrade the now broken existing 14AWG/15A line to a fresh 12AWG/20A out to the septic pump but Jim can attest to this - it has been raining here in Anne Arundel County MD about every 3 to 4 days for over a month, which is when that line out to the septic went down. A bloody mess to try and dig in.

You all have been such a great help. Once I got out of the way, you all figured it out. Thanks so much!!!
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Old 12-05-2009, 01:52 PM   #37
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900W and up trips breaker, Circuit draws power even with everything off...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoyizit View Post
http://www.google.com/search?client=...UTF-8&oe=UTF-8
"15" means 14.5 to 15.4. It is a nominal, vs actual, value, just like a 2x4 is not 2.0 x 4.0.

"15.0" means 14.95 to 15.04.

We're not looking here for a few errant milliwatts. This fault is pretty large. We don't need precision.
I was pointing out that the breaker does not trip where you said it would in this quote. There is a significant headroom, which varies timewise, based on an overload.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoyizit View Post
15A @ 120v should trip at 1800w
Being the engineer that you are I would have expected you to know this.
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Old 12-05-2009, 01:54 PM   #38
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900W and up trips breaker, Circuit draws power even with everything off...


Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonblu View Post
jim, you're a genius (or im just really...not). that GFCI does connect to the outdoor outlet that i am running the extension cord out to my septic pump. this explains everything i think. themystery draw is from the 1 hp pump, and maybe explains the tripping. pump plus 900W heater = overload.


I almost worked up a sweat on that one. Time to relax.
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Old 12-05-2009, 03:57 PM   #39
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900W and up trips breaker, Circuit draws power even with everything off...


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Originally Posted by Jim Port View Post
I was pointing out that the breaker does not trip where you said it would in this quote. There is a significant headroom, which varies timewise, based on an overload.



Being the engineer that you are I would have expected you to know this.
". . .exactness obsessions strongly correlated with ordering compulsions and mildly with repeating and hoarding rituals"
So, do you hoard stuff?

The defense rests. Again.
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Old 12-05-2009, 04:05 PM   #40
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900W and up trips breaker, Circuit draws power even with everything off...


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Originally Posted by Yoyizit View Post
". . .exactness obsessions strongly correlated with ordering compulsions and mildly with repeating and hoarding rituals"
So, do you hoard stuff?

The defense rests. Again.
I am not sure what all this drivel means.

If it means that I give technically correct and Code compliant answers in order to help someone the answer would be yes. I also point out the errors posted by others.

If the purpose of these forums is to help educate someone should not the infomation be understandable and accurate?

Last edited by Jim Port; 12-05-2009 at 04:08 PM.
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Old 12-09-2009, 02:29 PM   #41
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900W and up trips breaker, Circuit draws power even with everything off...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Port View Post
I am not sure what all this drivel means.

If it means that I give technically correct and Code compliant answers in order to help someone the answer would be yes. I also point out the errors posted by others.

If the purpose of these forums is to help educate someone should not the infomation be understandable and accurate?
Remember, back in high school, they had take-home exams?
You had as much time as you needed to figure it out, and you were allowed to ask people, and you were allowed to look in the library?

Well, this is your personal take-home exam.

And, leaving the psych arena and going back to the technical arena, don't you still owe me homework? Something to do with voltage drops??


Last edited by Yoyizit; 12-09-2009 at 02:32 PM.
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