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Old 04-14-2012, 11:21 AM   #1
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225A Load Center


So, I decided to perform a service upgrade since I just finished installing an underground service lateral.

I believe the service upgrade falls under the NJ rehab code, so NEC 2005 would apply.

To the point, I would like to use 4/0 SEU to supply a 225A load center within about 18 inches of the meter pan. Can I use the 90 column under NEC 2005, which yields 205A, allowing me to use the next size up?

If not, I don't even know where to buy 3/0 copper SEU by the foot. Of course, I can get 3/0 THHN ($6/ft. per conductor) and 250 kcmil Aluminum, but 2" rigid conduit would be extremely difficult to install in the present location.

I could put in a 200A main breaker, but I foresee the day when I will need the extra 25A, as I add more 7 kilowatt mini splits, etc. 320A service is not an option, since the service lateral is 4/0 aluminum triplex.

CL200 meters with 225A service:

http://www.inspectorsjournal.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1438


Last edited by benjamincall; 04-14-2012 at 03:18 PM.
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Old 04-14-2012, 11:25 AM   #2
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225A Load Center


you'll have to use the 75 degree c ampacity columns. i highly doubt your panel is rated for 90 degree c terminations.

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Old 04-14-2012, 11:27 AM   #3
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225A Load Center


I have never seen CU SER. Also, I would check somewhere else on that 3/0, I just priced 1/0 at $1.13/foot.
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Old 04-14-2012, 11:31 AM   #4
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225A Load Center


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I have never seen CU SER. Also, I would check somewhere else on that 3/0, I just priced 1/0 at $1.13/foot.
they make it but i don't believe it is used very often. aluminum is just so much more cost effective.

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Old 04-14-2012, 12:37 PM   #5
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225A Load Center


I'll second that check other places for prices. Even the big box stores can beat $6 a foot. I believe my local Lowes is ~$4 a foot. The electrical supply house I used (platt.com) appears to also offer those sizes cut to length. They want $1.37/ft for 250 XHHW-2 Au and $3.35/ft for 3/0 THWN-2 Cu.

Actually, as I look some more are you sure you didn't get a price on XHHW Cu? Platt apparently wants $5.57/ft for it.
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Old 04-14-2012, 12:43 PM   #6
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225A Load Center


So, I've got to use invidual conductors in some sort of conduit?

Here's my panel:

http://products.schneider-electric.u...ber=QO142L225G

I haven't bought a main breaker yet, but this is the one I want to use:

http://products.schneider-electric.u...countrycode=us
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Old 04-14-2012, 12:55 PM   #7
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225A Load Center


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Originally Posted by a_lost_shadow View Post
I'll second that check other places for prices. Even the big box stores can beat $6 a foot. I believe my local Lowes is ~$4 a foot. The electrical supply house I used (platt.com) appears to also offer those sizes cut to length. They want $1.37/ft for 250 XHHW-2 Au and $3.35/ft for 3/0 THWN-2 Cu.

Actually, as I look some more are you sure you didn't get a price on XHHW Cu? Platt apparently wants $5.57/ft for it.
Must have been XHHW. If I can figure out some way to accommodate the conduit, do you think the 225A service will work? Just to recap:

135' (from the top of the pole) 4/0 aluminum triplex through 3" conduit, CL200 meter, 4/0 Cu or 250 Al in 2" PVC to the 225A load center.

Edit: The 75 column gives me 200A for 3/0 copper, so I guess I would have to go the next size up.

Last edited by benjamincall; 04-14-2012 at 01:02 PM.
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Old 04-14-2012, 12:59 PM   #8
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225A Load Center


Is this a residential service?
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Old 04-14-2012, 01:04 PM   #9
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225A Load Center


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Originally Posted by Speedy Petey View Post
Is this a residential service?
Yes, this is for my home.
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Old 04-14-2012, 01:05 PM   #10
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225A Load Center


You don't have to use single conductors. However, it's going to be easier to pull. Depending on what you're local supply houses stock, or what you find online. It may be cheaper and easier to find going single conductors.

Looking at the cut sheet from one manufacturer, it appears that they don't make 2 conductor w/ground SER cable larger than 4/0 Au. So you'd need to go up to 3 conductor w/ground for your service entrance. Doing the conduit fill calculation, I see that you'll also need 2 1/2" RMC to meet conduit fill.

Also remember if you go with a cable such as SER or SEU, you need to do the conduit fill based upon the outer diameter, or largest outer dimension for non round cables like SEU.
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Old 04-14-2012, 01:09 PM   #11
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225A Load Center


For residential main service you can often use NEC Table 310.15(B)(7) (I think it was B6 before 2011). This calls for 3/0 Cu or 250 mil Au for 225.
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Old 04-14-2012, 02:21 PM   #12
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225A Load Center


Just use 4/0AL or 2/0CU like any other typical 200A service.

Is this really a 225A load center, or a 200A main breaker panel?
If it is really 225A, where did you get it and where is the main breaker?
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Old 04-14-2012, 03:01 PM   #13
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225A Load Center


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Originally Posted by benjamincall View Post
So, I've got to use invidual conductors in some sort of conduit?

Here's my panel:

http://products.schneider-electric.u...ber=QO142L225G

I haven't bought the main breaker yet, but this is the one I want to use:

http://products.schneider-electric.u...countrycode=us
Petey,

I bought the panel from a supply house on eBay. It's an MLO panel to which I'm going to add a 225A main breaker (above).
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Old 04-14-2012, 03:58 PM   #14
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225A Load Center


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Originally Posted by benjamincall View Post
Petey,

I bought the panel from a supply house on eBay. It's an MLO panel to which I'm going to add a 225A main breaker (above).
WHY in the world did you buy that? Why not just get a standard main breaker panel?
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Answers based on the 2008 & 2011 NEC. If you're on the '14 already I feel sorry for you.
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Old 04-14-2012, 06:16 PM   #15
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225A Load Center


Quote:
Originally Posted by benjamincall View Post
So, I decided to perform a service upgrade since I just finished installing an underground service lateral.

I believe the service upgrade falls under the NJ rehab code, so NEC 2005 would apply.

To the point, I would like to use 4/0 SEU to supply a 225A load center within about 18 inches of the meter pan. Can I use the 90 column under NEC 2005, which yields 205A, allowing me to use the next size up?

If not, I don't even know where to buy 3/0 copper SEU by the foot. Of course, I can get 3/0 THHN ($6/ft. per conductor) and 250 kcmil Aluminum, but 2" rigid conduit would be extremely difficult to install in the present location.

I believe the service upgrade falls under the NJ rehab code, so NEC 2005 would apply.

I could put in a 200A main breaker, but I foresee the day when I will need the extra 25A, as I add more 7 kilowatt mini splits, etc. 320A service is not an option, since the service lateral is 4/0 aluminum triplex.

CL200 meters with 225A service:

http://www.inspectorsjournal.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1438
New Jersey has updated the ReHab Subcode to reference the 2008 NEC. Good thing I just updated this post a week ago to reflect the change.

DIY Electrical work in New Jersey

If you have any questions let me know.

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