Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > Home Improvement > Electrical

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 07-29-2012, 09:09 PM   #1
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 5
Share |
Question

120/120/208 Confused


A to grnd = 120v
B to grnd = 120v
c to grnd = 208v
A + B = 240v
A + C = 240v
B + C = 240v

Hooked up new 240v 1ph A/C system in building that has what I believe is 240v 3ph delta wiring.
Both air handler and condenser are on 2 pole breakers utilizing legs A and B, X13 DC drive motor overheated very quickly in air handler, as soon as contactor in condenser pulled in, it threw the main breaker. Why?
Swapped legs A and B in the panel and now everything works perfectly. Why?
This makes no sense to me as both legs are 120v and 1ph equipment is not phase specific. What am I missing?

Nem066 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2012, 09:22 PM   #2
E2 Electrician
 
stickboy1375's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Litchfield, CT
Posts: 5,086
Default

120/120/208 Confused


Quote:
Originally Posted by Nem066 View Post
A to grnd = 120v
B to grnd = 120v
c to grnd = 208v
A + B = 240v
A + C = 240v
B + C = 240v

Hooked up new 240v 1ph A/C system in building that has what I believe is 240v 3ph delta wiring.
Both air handler and condenser are on 2 pole breakers utilizing legs A and B, X13 DC drive motor overheated very quickly in air handler, as soon as contactor in condenser pulled in, it threw the main breaker. Why?
Swapped legs A and B in the panel and now everything works perfectly. Why?
This makes no sense to me as both legs are 120v and 1ph equipment is not phase specific. What am I missing?

That's a high leg delta service, generally phase "B" is the wildleg, You may have an open delta high leg and not a full delta, not sure if this is related to your issue or not. But the "kicker" transformer could be maxed out.

Was the air handler strictly 240v as well?


Last edited by stickboy1375; 07-29-2012 at 09:40 PM.
stickboy1375 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2012, 11:30 PM   #3
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 5
Default

120/120/208 Confused


Quote:
Originally Posted by stickboy1375 View Post
That's a high leg delta service, generally phase "B" is the wildleg, You may have an open delta high leg and not a full delta, not sure if this is related to your issue or not. But the "kicker" transformer could be maxed out.

Was the air handler strictly 240v as well?
Equipment is a residential 5 ton carrier split system 240v 1ph
Nem066 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2012, 04:59 AM   #4
E2 Electrician
 
stickboy1375's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Litchfield, CT
Posts: 5,086
Default

120/120/208 Confused


Quote:
Originally Posted by Nem066 View Post
Equipment is a residential 5 ton carrier split system 240v 1ph
So was both the outdoor unit and indoor unit using the high leg? And then you moved the breakers so the high leg wasn't being used, correct?
stickboy1375 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2012, 05:32 AM   #5
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 5
Question

120/120/208 Confused


Quote:
Originally Posted by stickboy1375 View Post
So was both the outdoor unit and indoor unit using the high leg? And then you moved the breakers so the high leg wasn't being used, correct?
No, was using both 120v legs in both instances, only thing changed polarity of legs A and B to equipment.

L1=A L2=B-----not working
L1=B L2=A-----working
C- not used in either scenario and is the 208v high leg.

Swapped A,B polarity multiple times and results always the same, just don't understand why.
Air handler uses a DC drive motor that has an integrated rectifier pack, in first scenario motor overheated quickly, in second scenario motor functions normally.

Last edited by Nem066; 07-30-2012 at 05:36 AM. Reason: addition
Nem066 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2012, 05:52 AM   #6
E2 Electrician
 
stickboy1375's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Litchfield, CT
Posts: 5,086
Default

120/120/208 Confused


Quote:
Originally Posted by Nem066 View Post
No, was using both 120v legs in both instances, only thing changed polarity of legs A and B to equipment.

L1=A L2=B-----not working
L1=B L2=A-----working
C- not used in either scenario and is the 208v high leg.

Swapped A,B polarity multiple times and results always the same, just don't understand why.
Air handler uses a DC drive motor that has an integrated rectifier pack, in first scenario motor overheated quickly, in second scenario motor functions normally.
Well that is a strange scenario you're describing, technically speaking, it should work either way, even if the high leg was included in the description.

What made you reverse the conductors on the breaker? Just out of curiosity....

Last edited by stickboy1375; 07-30-2012 at 05:57 AM.
stickboy1375 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2012, 06:07 AM   #7
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Nashua, NH, USA
Posts: 6,946
Default

120/120/208 Confused


All I can think of is that 120 volt loads in your building and also in neighboring buildings, combined, were unbalanced in a manner that when you swapped the two 120 volt hot to neutral lines (A and B in your case) you balanced the 120 volt loads (yours and your neighbors') better.

It would have been interesting to find out what the voltage the air conditioning units got at the time they overheated. Including hot to neutral on those lines.
__________________
Stop wasting time re-adjusting the pattern. Have several lawn sprinklers, one for each pattern.

Last edited by AllanJ; 07-30-2012 at 06:12 AM.
AllanJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2012, 06:31 AM   #8
E2 Electrician
 
stickboy1375's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Litchfield, CT
Posts: 5,086
Default

120/120/208 Confused


Allan, he's wiring a 240v appliance, the amperage drawn will be exactly the same on T1 and T2.
stickboy1375 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2012, 06:45 AM   #9
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 5
Default

120/120/208 Confused


Quote:
Originally Posted by stickboy1375 View Post
Well that is a strange scenario you're describing, technically speaking, it should work either way, even if the high leg was included in the description.

What made you reverse the conductors on the breaker? Just out of curiosity....
Shot in the dark mostly, I knew it wouldn't work when I did it, except it did.
Nem066 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2012, 07:10 AM   #10
E2 Electrician
 
stickboy1375's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Litchfield, CT
Posts: 5,086
Default

120/120/208 Confused


Quote:
Originally Posted by Nem066 View Post
Shot in the dark mostly, I knew it wouldn't work when I did it, except it did.
Funny what you will try when you get desperate to make something that should work, work.
stickboy1375 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2012, 12:05 PM   #11
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Nashua, NH, USA
Posts: 6,946
Default

120/120/208 Confused


Before: Most of the neighbor's 120 volt loads on phase A, most of your 120 vikr loads on phase A, adding the AC overloads phase A.

After swapping A and B in the panel: Most of the neighbors 120 volt load on phase A, most of your 120 volts loads on phase B, adding the AC (same additional draw on A and B) works OK.
__________________
Stop wasting time re-adjusting the pattern. Have several lawn sprinklers, one for each pattern.

Last edited by AllanJ; 07-30-2012 at 03:09 PM.
AllanJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2012, 01:39 PM   #12
E2 Electrician
 
stickboy1375's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Litchfield, CT
Posts: 5,086
Default

120/120/208 Confused


Quote:
Originally Posted by AllanJ View Post
Before: Most of the neighbor's 120 volt loads on phase A, most of your 120 vikr loads on phase A, adding the AC overloads phase A.

After: Most of the neighbors 120 volt load on phase A, most of your 120 volts loads on phase B, adding the AC (same additional draw on A and B) works OK.
I'm not sure what your trying to say here?

stickboy1375 is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
confused on switch replacement fullpint Electrical 6 07-11-2011 08:39 AM
Parallel path to Ground - I'm confused as usual robertmee Electrical 13 04-03-2011 09:37 AM
Confused about Sub Panel stqevo Electrical 28 10-01-2009 11:04 PM
Confused by switch w/indicator light install... WaldenL Electrical 7 08-29-2009 09:02 AM
Trying to wire my bathroom... confused... Alan Electrical 3 11-23-2008 04:44 PM




Top of Page | View New Posts

Copyright © 2003-2014 Escalate Media. All Rights Reserved.