Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > Home Improvement > HVAC

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 12-20-2011, 07:28 AM   #1
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Pa.
Posts: 95
Share |
Default

What Type Of Pump


I need to pump water out of my underground fuel oil tank. The Rental Center has a pump designed for fuels that I think may work. it is a 3 HP pump. But I am concerned that if it is a centrifugal pump, it may not work because these types of pumps are design to operate below the fluid level. The bottom of the tank sits about 5 to 5-1/2 feet below ground.
I believe a positive displacement pump should work. Would this be the right type of pump? I know that the discharge on these pumps has to be open before operating the pump. (no exceptions)
My fuel delivery company has notified me that they cannot deliver fuel if there is water in the tank.
This Spring, I will assist my neighbor who is a HVAC contractor to install a above ground tank.
He say that it would be better to install it on the sunny side of the house. Most of my neighbors have theirs installed on the opposite side. This may be because its the closest run to the boiler. But the sunny side may cause condensation, I think.
Your thoughts on this and my pump question?

rjordan393 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2011, 08:16 AM   #2
Member
 
biggles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Long Island
Posts: 3,600
Default

What Type Of Pump


might consider just disconnecting the fuel line to the boiler and connect the pump there and pull the tank wondering if the supply pipe on the tank sticks up within the tank

biggles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2011, 08:49 AM   #3
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Pa.
Posts: 95
Default

What Type Of Pump


My neigbor believes that the suction intake at the tank sits a few inches above the bottom of it. So I might be pulling fuel out of the tank and no water. If this is the case, then no water can be pumped out that way.

My neighbor has a duel impeller pump that he had used before with success and we tried using it and discovered it was leaking at the pump housing and would not work. A friend of his is going to take the pump apart and see it its repairable. But in the event he fails to get it repaired; then I need to know what type of pump I need to rent to do the job.
rjordan393 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2011, 10:31 AM   #4
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,720
Default

What Type Of Pump


Can't say for sure, but I believe that you would find that a plain old lever type barrel pump would work, as long as you get one with a long enough drop tube, or one that has pipe thread so that you could make your own drop tube. I have pumped quite a bit of heating oil that way, and can't remember for sure, but I think that is what I used to get the last of the oil out of our underground tank before I pulled it.
DexterII is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2011, 01:37 PM   #5
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Pa.
Posts: 95
Default

What Type Of Pump


Thanks,
There is a local company that sells barrel pumps that's almost like you described. The pump has a rotating handle instead of a lever. It can pump 10 gpm max. If my neighbors pump fails to do the job, I'll take a chance and purchase their barrel pump. I estimate there is between 12 to 15 gallons of water in the tank.
rjordan393 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2011, 03:57 PM   #6
Hvac Pro
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
Posts: 8,897
Default

What Type Of Pump


what are you going to do with this water, which may be mixed with oil? Cannot just pour it into the sewer or it may cause an explosion later and you could get caught and sued etc. May have to take it to a hazardous waste disposal facility or pay a oil co to pump it out and dispose of it legally 4 U.
__________________
"Cut it twice and it is still too short".
yuri is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2011, 04:52 PM   #7
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: PENNSYLVANIA
Posts: 2,212
Default

What Type Of Pump


I would use the barrel pump as explained earlier. Barrel pump would go direct to the bottom where the water is. 15 to 20 gallons I would buy empty plastic buckets from HD with lids pump it in there and wait for the day when the township takes hazardous waste. I would install the tank closest to the burner don't need the Sun. I have seen tanks half buried in snow in Alaska with no problems. That barrel pump will come in handy when you install the new tank to transfer the oil.
COLDIRON is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2011, 05:13 PM   #8
An old Tradesmen
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: PA
Posts: 24,378
Default

What Type Of Pump


One of those small pumps that you connect to a drill will work. But as above. How are you going to dispose of the water oil mix. Its a big fine if they catch you putting it into any drain.

PS. You might want to get rid of that under ground tank now instead of waiting. Or have it slurried. You will need to know how the water is getting in, and if your ground has been contaminated. if so, some big bucks to clean it up. The longer you wait, the more it can cost.
beenthere is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2011, 05:45 PM   #9
Hvac Pro
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
Posts: 8,897
Default

What Type Of Pump


they have technology now that can trace back to the origin so you may think U are safe but if it shows up in your sewer you are in MAJOR deep do do if U get caught. ground contamination is another HUGE expensive problem to deal with. ignorance of the law is NO excuse and you cannot run away from that problem or hide it. they keep records of all underground tanks and the owners and especially with gas stations and those records are kept for 50-100 yrs going back. we have some unsaleable lots here where former gas stations stood and until the tanks are dug out and the ground reclaimed/cleaned up the land is worthless and the problem of the original owner.
__________________
"Cut it twice and it is still too short".
yuri is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2011, 06:38 PM   #10
An old Tradesmen
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: PA
Posts: 24,378
Default

What Type Of Pump


The OP is from the same state as me. The DEP here is still trying to locate the former owners of one gas station to both fine them, and give them the clean up bill. From when the tanks originally started to leak back in the 70's, and the owners did nothing about it.
beenthere is online now   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to beenthere For This Useful Post:
ben's plumbing (12-20-2011)
Old 12-20-2011, 07:59 PM   #11
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: pa
Posts: 4,243
Default

What Type Of Pump


make no mistake about it ...Iused to work for the oil indusrty they can and will nail anyone to the wall for voilating codes dealing with transporting, or disposal of contaminated water and fuel mixture.....and Pa is one of those states thats very hard on the violator......
ben's plumbing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2011, 08:02 PM   #12
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: pa
Posts: 4,243
Default

What Type Of Pump


Quote:
Originally Posted by yuri View Post
they have technology now that can trace back to the origin so you may think U are safe but if it shows up in your sewer you are in MAJOR deep do do if U get caught. ground contamination is another HUGE expensive problem to deal with. ignorance of the law is NO excuse and you cannot run away from that problem or hide it. they keep records of all underground tanks and the owners and especially with gas stations and those records are kept for 50-100 yrs going back. we have some unsaleable lots here where former gas stations stood and until the tanks are dug out and the ground reclaimed/cleaned up the land is worthless and the problem of the original owner.
we use to due what is called kent- mor tank testing for the big oil companys....test we performed every 6-months...this test could detect the smallest amount of liquid leaking from a tank...
ben's plumbing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2011, 08:33 PM   #13
Hvac Pro
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
Posts: 8,897
Default

What Type Of Pump


I have had to deal with the authorities (Dept of Labor in Manitoba makes the gas fitters rules and enforcement) as well as a frivolous lawsuit and it is a VERY VERY nasty nerve wracking unpleasant affair when these big guns go up against you to "nail you to the wall". There is NO smiling or sociability, shuck and jive when it comes to legal issues, codes and infractions. These guys know as much as a tradesman and MORE so if a fella thinks he is smart and can get away with it you got a VERY big surprise comin to you. I certainly cannot afford a lawyer at $200/hr to tell me "ignorance of the law/rules is no excuse" and there is nothing he can do about it either.
__________________
"Cut it twice and it is still too short".
yuri is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2011, 08:36 PM   #14
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Pa.
Posts: 95
Default

What Type Of Pump


The barrel pump is on my purchase list. A new tank is on order. My neighbor got his pump fixed and he was able to get the water out of the tank. What ever fuel is left will be placed in the new tank.
Any water/fuel mix will be saved for the yearly haz-mat day collection. Also I was in error in my estimate of how much water was in the tank. Today, we removed about 6 gallons.
I am aware of some of the regulations regarding underground tanks and will consult with an attorney because the local oil delivery company found water in the tank 3 months after I purchased the property. So any liability imposed on me if oil got into the ground at this time is questionable.
A while back, I placed a question on this forum or on another on who makes the determination between leakage and condensation. No one had an answer. However I can assure all that any fuel or fuel/water mix will be disposed of properly.
rjordan393 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-20-2011, 08:50 PM   #15
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: pa
Posts: 4,243
Default

What Type Of Pump


Quote:
Originally Posted by rjordan393 View Post
The barrel pump is on my purchase list. A new tank is on order. My neighbor got his pump fixed and he was able to get the water out of the tank. What ever fuel is left will be placed in the new tank.
Any water/fuel mix will be saved for the yearly haz-mat day collection. Also I was in error in my estimate of how much water was in the tank. Today, we removed about 6 gallons.
I am aware of some of the regulations regarding underground tanks and will consult with an attorney because the local oil delivery company found water in the tank 3 months after I purchased the property. So any liability imposed on me if oil got into the ground at this time is questionable.
A while back, I placed a question on this forum or on another on who makes the determination between leakage and condensation. No one had an answer. However I can assure all that any fuel or fuel/water mix will be disposed of properly.
the only way to tell the difference is to have the tank tested.....if it hold pressure...then its condensation...

ben's plumbing is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Sump pump jerks when it turns on Sparkastic Plumbing 3 08-25-2011 06:51 PM
How to find out why your pool pump is not fully priming tripflex How To Guides 6 07-13-2011 06:31 PM
Rain Collection System Using Collection Tanks in Multiple Locations Gheuett Landscaping & Lawn Care 10 09-15-2010 08:30 AM
Re: Pump Control test Franklin msenkpiel Electrical 1 08-04-2010 07:22 AM
Low Well Pressure, Submersible Well Pump, Help Please! tpolk Plumbing 7 11-13-2009 06:13 PM




Top of Page | View New Posts

Copyright © 2003-2014 Escalate Media. All Rights Reserved.