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Old 01-25-2013, 11:36 AM   #16
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Is the venting on my furnace screwed up?


He seemed like he wanted to be reasonable. That is good.

1) He conceded the inlet had a lot of ice in it. At first he insisted it was sucked in snow, but eventually agreed it was frozen exhaust.
2) He agreed the vent was too short. He lengthened it from 8" to 14".
3) He agreed the pipes were a bit too close together. He turned the inlet 90 fitting away from the vent, thinking that would help
4) He disagreed about the required distance from the deck and the inside corner, saying those were a matter of code, which he didn't know right off hand.
5) He did not think it posed a threat to the heat exchanger. He says those are continually bathed in acidic condensate, so a bit more from the inlet won't matter.
6) He agreed that the system had 43 of the allowed 50 feet of pipe, so there was room to extend them past the deck.

I agreed to run it this way and see if I continued to get ice. He agreed to look into insulated pipes to extend them out further.

I have some questions:
A) Is #3 acceptable? It is shown as straight down in the installation manual, but it is well protected from snow, so maybe it is okay turned?
B) What is code for distance from inside corner and overhang typically?
C) Any truth to what he is saying about the #5?

I appreciate your help.

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Old 01-25-2013, 12:06 PM   #17
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Is the venting on my furnace screwed up?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Toller View Post
He seemed like he wanted to be reasonable. That is good.

1) He conceded the inlet had a lot of ice in it. At first he insisted it was sucked in snow, but eventually agreed it was frozen exhaust.
2) He agreed the vent was too short. He lengthened it from 8" to 14".
3) He agreed the pipes were a bit too close together. He turned the inlet 90 fitting away from the vent, thinking that would help
4) He disagreed about the required distance from the deck and the inside corner, saying those were a matter of code, which he didn't know right off hand.I am sure that the inspectors here would not allow it as you have essentially a closed area/enclosed space which you cannot vent into. Depends how you look at it and interpret the code but they can red tag it disallow it due to poor quality workmanship if they want to. I would call that space enclosed and not open. I don't have a US code book or the time to hunt down your regulations (if you are in the US) but it makes no sense the way it is now. The code is NOT in the install manual but the actual gas code book so just because it does not describe it in the manual means nothing.
5) He did not think it posed a threat to the heat exchanger. He says those are continually bathed in acidic condensate, so a bit more from the inlet won't matter.WRONG, the burners are aluminum and will get corroded and so will the flame sensor and ONLY the secondary heat exchanger can handle acid, The primary will get corroded. Probably he does not know the difference or that there are 2 heat exchangers. Exhaust in the intake depletes the burner of oxygen and can cause a dirty flame and carbon up the heat exchanger etc and can be dangerous. Your biggest problem is not the code issue but the fact the furnace is sucking in its own dirty exhaust, think your car would like to run on its own exhaust. NYET. NO.
6) He agreed that the system had 43 of the allowed 50 feet of pipe, so there was room to extend them past the deck.

I agreed to run it this way and see if I continued to get ice. He agreed to look into insulated pipes to extend them out further.

I have some questions:
A) Is #3 acceptable? It is shown as straight down in the installation manual, but it is well protected from snow, so maybe it is okay turned?
B) What is code for distance from inside corner and overhang typically?
C) Any truth to what he is saying about the #5?

I appreciate your help.
.....
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Last edited by yuri; 01-25-2013 at 12:16 PM.
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Old 01-25-2013, 02:21 PM   #18
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Is the venting on my furnace screwed up?


WRONG, the burners are aluminum and will get corroded and so will the flame sensor and ONLY the secondary heat exchanger can handle acid, The primary will get corroded. Probably he does not know the difference or that there are 2 heat exchangers. Exhaust in the intake depletes the burner of oxygen and can cause a dirty flame and carbon up the heat exchanger etc and can be dangerous.

Aw, just when I thought I was making progress...

I bought a 6 year old house. Supposedly the first owner never had it cleaned. I had a purchase condition that it be cleaned and inspected by the installer. He did, and reported that it was in perfect condition and hardly dirty.
After 6 heating seasons (possibly at reduced temperatures, because they didn't live here) would it show corrosion and be extremely dirty?

Ball park, what is the cost to replace the primary, flame sensor, and burners?
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Old 01-25-2013, 04:50 PM   #19
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Is the venting on my furnace screwed up?


I doubt you need a new heat exchanger yet but you should get a experienced reputable Trane dealer to check it properly, not some cheap Joes heat em and cheatem. He can tell you if repairs are needed and it would be a good idea for you to be there so he can visually show you the condition. If the installer is a jerk you may need to pay the Trane dealer to do the job properly. Trane is a very good unit so it is worth taking care of.
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Old 01-25-2013, 05:07 PM   #20
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Is the venting on my furnace screwed up?


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Originally Posted by yuri View Post
I doubt you need a new heat exchanger yet but you should get a experienced reputable Trane dealer to check it properly, not some cheap Joes heat em and cheatem. He can tell you if repairs are needed and it would be a good idea for you to be there so he can visually show you the condition. If the installer is a jerk you may need to pay the Trane dealer to do the job properly. Trane is a very good unit so it is worth taking care of.
Same with the burners and flame sensor? If so, that would be great news. Supposedly it has never iced up before, so maybe the situation isn't all that bad.

I think I am going to ask to meet with the contractor and mention that 5 months ago he inspected the system and said it was in perfect condition.
Accordingly I would just ask him to run the vent out past the inner corner (another 3 feet) and give me a company warranty on the possibly affected parts for their normal life.
Does that seem like a reasonable thing to ask?
What is their normal life?
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Old 01-25-2013, 05:20 PM   #21
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Is the venting on my furnace screwed up?


I would have to inspect it myself to know if there is damage but you read Marty's post and damage does occur but if you are lucky it did not recirc too bad or long and it may be minimal. Personally I would call another Trane dealer and get a 2nd opinion as the installer just wants to be rid of you. I doubt you can get any more warranty so just get a 2nd Trane guy to clean it and if it is badly damaged then take pics and contact Trane and see if the district manager can lean on the installer or help out. Trane, Lennox, Carrier have huge reputations and advertising to maintain so sometimes they will take care of you but you got to be VERY polite, non threatening etc or they get their backs up to the wall and will not be so nice either. The pipe definetly needs to be extended AND insulated with 2" black armaflex refrigeration pipe insulation.

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Last edited by yuri; 01-25-2013 at 05:23 PM.
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