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Old 11-02-2011, 02:37 PM   #1
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Tamper proofing thermostat guard ideas... what do you think?


I just bought one of those honeywell plastic thermostat guards to mess with and see if I can change the temp on my honeywell dial (manual) stat. The ventilation holes in the side allow you to put a curved shaped wire through them and dial the thermostat up or down. SO...here are my two ideas:
put a blob of fun tack on the dial so it can't be moved with a wire.
make a dome out of metal window screening and put this over the stat before I close the guard cover. the wire should get caught up in the screening so you can't touch the dial.

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Old 11-02-2011, 03:04 PM   #2
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Tamper proofing thermostat guard ideas... what do you think?


Just get a honeywell digital and lockout the temp settings.....

Locks are for honest people......

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Old 11-02-2011, 03:17 PM   #3
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Tamper proofing thermostat guard ideas... what do you think?


LOL! These boards are where I learned that the digital stats with a code are easily tampered with. How??? Plus I need 5 of them and they have to work with the zone valves. I'm trying to figure out the least expensive way to do this. I found out that the gas bill for this 5 unit was $1500 per month last winter!!!That's almost what comes in in rent! That's with the tenants setting the temp where they want it. I was just there yesterday. She had the stat at 72, the heat was on and the windows were wide open.
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Old 11-02-2011, 03:54 PM   #4
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Tamper proofing thermostat guard ideas... what do you think?


if you want to take full control away from the tenent might consider thermostats that have optional zone sensors wired in and then centralize the 5 stats in a locked utility room forget about the guards once they get in one they will rip the others off the walls.is that gas furnaces or hot water baseboard heating to each? if the stats are T87 round..might consider these if you still want covers Grainger Supply...#2E777 ,might consider accustats with fixed temp bulbs no dials.if there banging the gas bill any change is worth it now before the real cold weather kicks in.if it is a furnace per tenent you can install a return air temperature control that will know out the furnace when the return comes back limiting the settings up top say 60F-65F return air furnace cycles off.commercially you see all these chain drug stores,value stores they all run sensing back to a central control that control the rooftop heat they set the central panel and that it when the sensor sees the space temps
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Old 11-02-2011, 04:51 PM   #5
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Tamper proofing thermostat guard ideas... what do you think?


With a locking thermostat cover, they will still open the windows.

Instead of the locking covers. Get and install, or have installed an outdoor reset control. And set the reset curve so that the water only gets hot enough to heat the apartments to 70. It will save you more then it cost in the first cold month. And they can set the thermostats as high s they want, the boiler won't heat the water any hotter then the control allows it.
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Old 11-02-2011, 08:00 PM   #6
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Tamper proofing thermostat guard ideas... what do you think?


Quote:
Originally Posted by beenthere
With a locking thermostat cover, they will still open the windows.

Instead of the locking covers. Get and install, or have installed an outdoor reset control. And set the reset curve so that the water only gets hot enough to heat the apartments to 70. It will save you more then it cost in the first cold month. And they can set the thermostats as high s they want, the boiler won't heat the water any hotter then the control allows it.
Im afraid you already told him this..
He has gone into control freak mode.
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Old 11-02-2011, 08:15 PM   #7
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Tamper proofing thermostat guard ideas... what do you think?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Master of Cold View Post
Im afraid you already told him this..
He has gone into control freak mode.
Maybe he'll understand it better this time.
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Old 11-02-2011, 08:49 PM   #8
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Tamper proofing thermostat guard ideas... what do you think?


You'd think they could design a guard that would allow a flow of air to get to the temp senser of a thermostat but not the controls.

Tenents have little incentive to open the windows wide if they have limited heat.

Also.. Why not just recalibrate a mercury thermostat to shut off at what ever maximum you want? I'm sure every hvac tech carrys the tool to do just that.

Last edited by how; 11-02-2011 at 08:54 PM.
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Old 11-02-2011, 09:45 PM   #9
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Tamper proofing thermostat guard ideas... what do you think?


Search "construction thermostat". Used on construction sites, no adjustment, just one preset temperature. It installs anywhere in the return plenum that is convenient, somewhere out of sight.
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Old 11-02-2011, 11:52 PM   #10
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Construction thermostats are not permitted to be used as a comfort thermostat by code. He could get some REAL nice fines for doing so.
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Old 11-03-2011, 07:25 AM   #11
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Tamper proofing thermostat guard ideas... what do you think?


Hello!
First of all, "he" is a "she." Last year the gas bill for this building was over $3000 for Jan and Feb. The tenants cranked the heat up as high as they wanted and opened the windows to cool the place off. With a GROSS income of $2200 a month, I will go into forclosure if I don't do something this winter.
I am seriously considering both an outdoor resent AND a thermostat guard. If I go with the Accustat stat and the 68F sensor then I'll never be able to raise or lower the temp in the apartment to accommodate the needs of the tenants. The problem with the outdoor reset as you can read below is that the tenant (without the lock on it) can set the temp on the stat to 80F and the circulation pump will run constantly in a futile attempt to warm the apartment up.
I have read two articles on outdoor reset controls and written to Carol Fey a published author on the topic who was very helpful.
Here is a transcription of our conversation for those of you who would like more info on outdoor resets
Dear Carol,
I just finished reading your article on outdoor reset. I have a 5 zone hot water boiler (radiators). Each apartment has it's own thermostat. If I were to install an outdoor reset would the thermostats be rendered ineffective because the reset would be determining the amount of heat coming out? Would I read the thermostats in each zone to determine the range?
Thank you for your help,






The thermostats and the inside temperature aren't affected at all by outdoor reset. Outdoor reset simply adjusts the water temperature in the boiler. If it's warmer outside, you need less heat inside, so there's less heat stored in the boiler because you don't need a lot. Means it costs you less money to get the same heat in the apartments. Extra heat in the boiler water just gets wasted.
-




As the system is now, doesn't the boiler just fire up and heat the water when the thermostat tells it to? With an outdoor reset are the pumps constantly circulating the water around the zones and the water temp just varies according to the outside temp? If so, wouldn't this wear out the pumps? Are the pumps electric?
Thanks again... I really appreciate your help on this.

As it is now, the boiler always keeps the water temperature hot enough, say 180 degrees F, for the coldest possible outside temperature. Since that extreme low temp. happens only a few times a year, a lot of heat and money is wasted by always being ready for it. The outdoor temperature sensor keeps the water a little less hot when it's warmer outside, which is most of the time, so you pay less. The apartments still get all the heat they need. Nothing changes in the entire system except for the temperature of the water and how big your bill is.

When there's a need for heat in one the the apartments, the thermostat opens a valve to allow the boiler's hot water, whatever temperature it is, to flow through the apartment radiator until the room is warm enough. Then it tells the valve to close. Depending upon the kind of system you have, the pump (yes electric) might be moving water all the time, but more likely only when the thermostat says that an apartment needs heat. The constant pump systems are usually in high-rise type buildings.

I'm beginning to understand. So the thermostats still work in that they trigger the valve to open and circulate hot water through the apartment. I just bought this building and each apartment has it's own thermostat and I pay for the heat. The tenants crank the heat up really high then open windows to cool the place off when they get too hot. I went on a message board and they said a solution to this problem is to install an outdoor reset and then you can set the max temp each apartment will get no matter what temperature they set their thermostat to. Couldn't they set their thermostat to 80F and the pump for their zone just keep circulating in a futile attempt to warm the apartment up?- Show quoted text -

Yep, you're describing a common apartment building heating problem. The only way I know of to cap the temperature is to use thermostats with a limited range. Honeywell at least used to have some that had a max temp setting of something like 72 degrees.
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I looked at those and they're $60 each! I think I'm going to buy the locking thermostat covers and hope they don't tamper with them. Thanks for all your help. I finally get it.- Show quoted text -

They will tamper with them is for no other reason than they are there! Best wishes.
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Old 11-03-2011, 07:56 AM   #12
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Tamper proofing thermostat guard ideas... what do you think?


Charge extra for heat.

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Old 11-03-2011, 05:03 PM   #13
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Tamper proofing thermostat guard ideas... what do you think?


They make an adjustable accustat bulb.
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Old 11-03-2011, 08:06 PM   #14
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Tamper proofing thermostat guard ideas... what do you think?


I saw that adjustable accustat sensor (bulb) and then it would be no different than what I have... I'd need a guard.
I'm going to get the outdoor reset AND the thermostat guards.
Thank you everyone for your advice. I really appreciate it.
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Old 11-03-2011, 08:31 PM   #15
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Tamper proofing thermostat guard ideas... what do you think?


Putting the guards on the thermostats is a waste of money. The tenants are going to be pissed of and rip them off, probably in the first week. And what if they want to turn the heat off?

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