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Old 12-21-2008, 09:06 AM   #1
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Which Stat for New Carrier 58 MV


I live near Buffalo and I'm about to have a Carrier 58MV installed.
I have a working General G1042L humidifier and a new Aprilaire 760 A as a spare on the shelf. I also have a new Honeywell T8624D-2004 Stat still in the box.
The Carrrier guys tell me I will not get the maximum benefit of the 58MV without their stat but they want an extra $350. for the "CONTROLLER". If I want outside sensing in future the Aprilaire humidistat could do that if it works with the Honeywell but they say the General is Ok with the 58MVB so it's staying for now
I should also mention I've been insulating and sealing the attic, sill plate ring joist, and venting etc in a 30 year old house so I'm "tightening up the envelope" which is changing our indoor humidity
Will I benefit that much from using the Carrier Controler, model unspecified???????The Lennox giuys told me the Honeywell Stat is what they use

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Old 12-21-2008, 10:30 AM   #2
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Which Stat for New Carrier 58 MV


Even though I am a Lennox guy I usually recommend matching name brand products when buying the top notch premium units. That way you get all the special features/bells and whistles. Lennox has special Signature/Comfortsense stats with extra features for their units. Makes it a bit easier to troubleshoot IMO. If I call Tech support with a different brand they can question whether the other brand is the problem. I have the General 1042 and you nmay not need more humidity in the future. It will be good enough to bump up the humidity and most boards have a 24v HUM terminal. Honeywell makes the stats for Lennox but adds features for them. The Vision Pro IAQ product with the interface module is nice. I would be leery of product incompatibility with the Carrier unless someone else knows them well.

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Old 12-21-2008, 10:58 AM   #3
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Which Stat for New Carrier 58 MV


Thanks Yuri,
BTW, havent signed the dotted line for the Carrier yet. The Lennox G71 guy was favourable and professional too. My dilemma is really who to choose. I'm very technically inclined but Lennox / Carrier is all Greek to me. I've installed Cvac for 20 plus years and understand the ducting, air flow, venting, motor sizing etc, and home construction/ insullation but feel my hands are tied with new furnace technology. How do you win. Both dealers are reputable. Pricing is $400 more for the Carrier but is 80BTU vs 70? on the Lennox. The Lennox guy said my General would not be adeqiuite with the Lennox G71 at low speed so I should use my Aprilaire (which he wanted to supply add another $350). Sounds a bit strange.I seem to read more Carrier MV problems on this sight than Lennox
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Old 12-21-2008, 11:14 AM   #4
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Which Stat for New Carrier 58 MV


If they are talking about the Infinity control.
There is no other thermostat that can match it.

If they are talking about the Thermidistat, its still a better stat then the T8624D.

As the Thermidistat also can control a humidifier, and slow the blower to help dehumidify in the summer. And is a supported stat for that furnace.

If you use your T8624D, the Carrier board will decide when to use third stage.

Have you gotten any estimates on the York mod furnace.
It uses a regular thermostat, the furnace control board controls the modulation(65 steps of modulation, compared to Carriers 3 steps).
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Old 12-21-2008, 12:04 PM   #5
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Which Stat for New Carrier 58 MV


The G71 is an excellent unit and I have sold quite a few of them. It can work with any type of humidifier/Buddy is trying to upsell you. It has infinite stages of modulation and the board controls the ECM inducer speeds which control vacuum which controls the gas valve. Very simple concept. We are using most of ours as 3 stage units and I will know more about the modulating ones soon. I have worked on ALL brands and find Lennox has the best Tech support/Davenet etc. Buy the Comfortsense thermostat as it has de-humidification features/controls the cooling ramping speed of the ECM motor etc. I am still leery about Carrier after the class action lawsuit/heat exchanger failure fiasco. Still using the same exchanger with "improved" coating?? The Lennox is all stainless steel. Have them do a proper heat loss calculation to determine the correct size for you. Lennox makes a 90,000 also. Or do it yourself:http://www.hvac.cc/

Last edited by yuri; 12-21-2008 at 12:07 PM.
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Old 12-21-2008, 03:10 PM   #6
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Which Stat for New Carrier 58 MV


Yuri, Thanks, the thing I like best about Winnipeg is the wife I left there with after 3 years. Summers were fabulous but had enoough cold winters in SASK as a kid to toughen me up, Southern ON feels like Grand Beach in July by comparison.
Thanks to both you and beenthere for the explanation on the stats and cold air return suggestions, humidifiers. I looked briefly at the new HE York in a York / Lennox Dealer. Was impressed with the exchanger design but not the dealer who tried to sell me a Lennox G71 display model with visible internal water residue which I laterdiscoverredwas from a venting problem on a unit he had yanked and replaceddue to outstanding payment issues ... he said) Had heard the Yok DC motors are over $700 if problematic
I left the showroom and never looked back. Didn't spend enough time on the York after that. My current furnace is 34 years old , 100,000 BTU in 79,000 out. It's still running but I might as well be lighting the fireplace with $20 bills. I'm only heating 1800 ft, 2 story, brick - stucco 34 years old, unfinished basement. Had an energy audit done so I'm battening down the hatches with winter arriving and blowing in the attic to R50. Figure between hydro and gas I'll save at least $50 a month year round going HE so I can`t loose in the short term....
I have steered away form Sears $0 interest plan due to the Carrier MV80 being $800 less with the independent. Both Lennox and York are still options. Still open to feedback.
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Old 12-21-2008, 04:11 PM   #7
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Which Stat for New Carrier 58 MV


With the exception of Carrier.
Everybody uses the same ECM motors.
Carrier is starting to use the 3.0 version.

Everyone else is using the ver 2.3, and a few may be switching to the ver 2.5

So motor cost is the same, other then the contractors mark up.

I know what York ECMs(VS/DC motors) cost, and the price you said, has some nice mark up on it.
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Old 12-21-2008, 06:37 PM   #8
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Which Stat for New Carrier 58 MV


The G71 uses the new 3.0 motor. I would not base my decision on one display unit. If you don't trust the Lennox dealer check out a few others. I can tell you a bunch of special added features that unit has if you are interested/can understand the technical aspects of it. The best unit installed by a poor contractor will not work properly anyway. There have been NO venting issues with those units and it gets to -30 in Wpg with howling winds. That unit has a vent calibration routine and calibrates the pressure switches/parameters which no on else has that I know of. We do have some hot ladies here if you unbundle them. Been below -20 for 2 weeks now. Friend of mine worked in Thompson. Wpg is like Florida compared to there. Can always find somewhere colder to be. Cost of living is quite reasonable here. If you have a 100,000 BTU unit now and are upgrading the house a G71 70,000 will be fine. The 90 will have more output than the one you have now. 70 or 80 units will both be fine. Insulate the basement and the 70 will be more than enough.

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Last edited by yuri; 12-21-2008 at 06:46 PM.
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Old 12-21-2008, 06:53 PM   #9
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Which Stat for New Carrier 58 MV


Thanks Yuri,
I remember January in Winterpeg very well. Was there when the army helped plough the snow mid 80s.
I was impressed with the G71 I saw at a reputable dealer, however he was the one pushing to replace my 3 year old General humidifier saying it would not function well with the furnace on low output as it was a flow through with no fan. As you said, he wanted to upsell me. I appreciate your feedback.
So I'm not done yet. What will the Lennox do to outperform the Carrier?
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Old 12-21-2008, 07:16 PM   #10
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Which Stat for New Carrier 58 MV


There will be less airflow on low speed but I would try the one you have now and if it works then you have no problem and save $350. The guy is just trying to make a living selling his products/not necessarily dishonest. You may not need one anyway. I always tell my customers to buy a humidifier later if they need one. Some of them have to add fresh air intakes to the return duct to get rid of moisture from the house that normally went up the chimney. I have a Lifebreath HRV and love it for ventilation.I am not familiar with the newest Carriers but honestly can say that I do not like the direction that Carrier is headed in and am leery of their heat exchangers because of the previous failures with their condensing coils. Still like them better than Goodman. We have a bunch of G71s running now in -30 deg weather and no complaints. You can use it as a modulating unit OR a 3 stage unit (40/70/100 staging). I am sure the Carrier is a reasonably good unit and would pick it #2 over the other brands. MY opinions only! Don't want to get flamed by Carrier lovers. Suppertime now and then Extreme Home Makeover/check back occasionally.

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Last edited by yuri; 12-21-2008 at 07:20 PM.
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Old 12-21-2008, 07:35 PM   #11
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Which Stat for New Carrier 58 MV


The G71, when in mod setting.
Will start at 70% modulation, and then go to its last modulation rate of the previous call.
It will mod up or down as needed from there.

The Carrier is 3 stage only(I don't consider 3 stages a mod).

In their defense, they haven't had a secondary problem since changing the coating process.

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