Go Back   DIY Chatroom Home Improvement Forum > Home Improvement > HVAC

CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 01-17-2012, 05:33 PM   #1
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 10
Rewards Points: 0
Share |
Question

New control board or fix it?


I'm assuming I need a new control board for this furnace. Maybe it can simply be repaired or isn't even the problem in the first place.

Carrier Weathermaker 9200 58MXA
Part # on current control board is HK42FZ016
I'm thinking of getting the ICM282 as a replacement. Working on small electronics doesn't bother me so if this cheaper board does the job once it is installed I'm not paying OEM prices just so it looks the same.

Here's my problem though. (this furnace has been running fine for 10 years) The induction fan comes on, the fire starts, no error codes are flashed but the instant the blower comes on the flame goes out. The blower runs for a minute while it flashes the code 12 (one short two long) and then shuts off. Code 12 just says the blower is running for 90 seconds after a call for heat (R-W closed). What is "R-W closed" anyway, maybe this is my problem? Ten minutes later it cycles through this again and it never ends. Flame sensor looks basically new. I cleaned it a touch with some 1200 grit sand paper but that was purely cosmetic I think. If I leave it disconnected I get error codes so I'm assuming it works.

The trouble shooting guide leads me to checking the DC microamps on the flame sensor wire. This guide is confused though because it first says "Is the DC microamps below 0.5?" and then in the very next troubleshooting bubble is says the "current is nominally 4.0 to 6.0 microamps". So which is it, 0.5 or 5.0? Doesn't really matter though because my amp meter is a Fluke t5-600 and won't measure these small amps anyway. So as I mentioned I'm assuming the flame control sensor is working and it's a problem in the control board.

Can I fiddle with some jumper settings on this board and get it to work? Clean it maybe? I don't know, I'm grasping at anything that isn't a $200 plus OEM board.

Thanks in advance for any useful information about this. I hope I've explained it well enough.

Bobeht is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2012, 05:56 PM   #2
I'm Your Huckleberry
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 5,768
Rewards Points: 28
Default

New control board or fix it?


How does the system perform in "fan on" or "cool" ?

__________________
Thanks.
Doc Holliday is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2012, 05:57 PM   #3
Member
 
biggles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Long Island
Posts: 3,630
Rewards Points: 0
Default

New control board or fix it?


"R to W closure" indication is the heat call from the stat then the rest is the board as should the Induced Draft motor is the first to run from that R/W call...if it is only getting a pilot but no burner when fan starts sound like the board..but i'm not spending your money on that let other kick in model and brand and honeywell stamped number on the board so they have something to work with.... check them here http://www.bestbuyheatingandaircondi...cuitboards.htm

Last edited by biggles; 01-17-2012 at 06:00 PM.
biggles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2012, 05:57 PM   #4
Part of the Clover Leaf
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NW Burbs of Detroit Mi.
Posts: 1,107
Rewards Points: 0
Default

New control board or fix it?


your manual is correct. .05 micro amps is the minimum flame signal reading the burners will stay lit at. The normal range a clean sensor will read is between 4 and 6 micro amps. You need a DC micro amp meter to read it.
hvac5646 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2012, 06:02 PM   #5
I'm Your Huckleberry
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 5,768
Rewards Points: 28
Default

New control board or fix it?


R-W closed mean while on call for heat the entire furnce (control board) is losing power, power is interupted. When power is restored to the board the blower comes on again with the 90 second "on" time delay.

Your board is most likely malfunctioning at this point or judging by your description of what is going on I'd have to assume so. A board should never lose power and come back on with a time delay unless actual high voltage power has been turned off to the unit and turned back on again.

It should never do it during a call for heat or otherwise.

You can pull the board off and look on the back for any burn marks.
__________________
Thanks.
Doc Holliday is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2012, 06:04 PM   #6
I'm Your Huckleberry
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 5,768
Rewards Points: 28
Default

New control board or fix it?


Quote:
Originally Posted by hvac5646 View Post
your manual is correct. .05 micro amps is the minimum flame signal reading the burners will stay lit at. The normal range a clean sensor will read is between 4 and 6 micro amps. You need a DC micro amp meter to read it.
This.



..and since one smiley is not enough to reply to a thread, this too..

.
__________________
Thanks.
Doc Holliday is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2012, 06:08 PM   #7
I'm Your Huckleberry
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 5,768
Rewards Points: 28
Default

New control board or fix it?


OP, are you saying that while on call for heat the initial heat sequence begins all the way through to when the blower comes on (last) but as soon as it does the unit goes to fault code 12/90 second blower on, turning off the heat in the process?

If that is the case then you need another board. I wouldn't even mess with the old one.
__________________
Thanks.
Doc Holliday is online now   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Doc Holliday For This Useful Post:
Bobeht (01-17-2012)
Old 01-17-2012, 06:18 PM   #8
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 10
Rewards Points: 0
Default

New control board or fix it?


Good idea Doc, I'll go pull the thing and see if it's burnt. It has no funky smell like so many other fryed electronic devices I've been responsible for destroying but it's also hard to see well where it is now. To biggles post, it's not just a pilot burning, it's the full on flame in each heat exchanger burning away like it's supposed to. It blows luke warm air for the 90 seconds the blower is on because of the burner being on for a minute or so before it goes out.
Bobeht is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2012, 06:39 PM   #9
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 10
Rewards Points: 0
Default

New control board or fix it?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Holliday View Post
OP, are you saying that while on call for heat the initial heat sequence begins all the way through to when the blower comes on (last) but as soon as it does the unit goes to fault code 12/90 second blower on, turning off the heat in the process?

If that is the case then you need another board. I wouldn't even mess with the old one.
Yes, exactly this. You've answered what I needed to know I guess. Thanks for that. Any advice on if I can do better (cheaper) than the ICM282? I saw an ICM282A but I doubt I'd need the options it has over the original.
Bobeht is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2012, 06:47 PM   #10
Member
 
biggles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Long Island
Posts: 3,630
Rewards Points: 0
Default

New control board or fix it?


leave the board off the mounting(slip a piec of cardboard to support it),and then restart it with everything connected...might need a ground jumper that a screw would provide just in case it just sits there see if you get a different sequence..even fan vibration might be effecting the board signal for the main burner....just thinking out loud...didn't see your unit info first time reading... DAH sorry
biggles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2012, 08:15 PM   #11
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 10
Rewards Points: 0
Default

New control board or fix it?


A new development has arisen. I liked biggles' idea about messing with the board. So I did. It was a little more of a pain then I wanted so instead of removing the board mounting entirely I popped it loose but basically left it there. It wasn't loose everywhere but most places. This time when the blower came on the burner lasted a couple of seconds before it quit. Any change is good I'm thinking so I blew everything out with an air hose and hooked it back up. The thermostat is upstairs of the furnace so I wanted to shorten my trips. First thing I did was blow the 3 amp fuse by shorting the thermostat wires to the ground with my screw driver, entirely my bad for being sloppy but I found a 5 amp and put it in there for today. I unhooked the thermostat wires (only had 2) and hooked up a 3 foot chunk of speaker wire to hang out of the furnace instead. When I twist the wires together the furnace operates just like it should. Of course it'll stay on forever if I leave it like this but now I know the control board is apparently fine and the thermostat is the problem. This is old school tech here, just a temp sensitive spring and a contact point. I don't see how a thermostat that could be from the 70's is the problem but it is. It is just a contact point after all.

Doc first asked me about a "fan on" or "cool" option. I'm guessing I somehow have the option to have this thing hooked up to just circulate air. Maybe if I get the right thermostat I can do this I'm thinking? That would be nice for summer but it's never been an option the way it was installed.
Bobeht is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2012, 08:49 PM   #12
Part of the Clover Leaf
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NW Burbs of Detroit Mi.
Posts: 1,107
Rewards Points: 0
Default

New control board or fix it?


????????????
hvac5646 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2012, 09:07 PM   #13
I'm Your Huckleberry
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 5,768
Rewards Points: 28
Default

New control board or fix it?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobeht View Post
A new development has arisen. I liked biggles' idea about messing with the board. So I did. It was a little more of a pain then I wanted so instead of removing the board mounting entirely I popped it loose but basically left it there. It wasn't loose everywhere but most places. This time when the blower came on the burner lasted a couple of seconds before it quit. Any change is good I'm thinking so I blew everything out with an air hose and hooked it back up. The thermostat is upstairs of the furnace so I wanted to shorten my trips. First thing I did was blow the 3 amp fuse by shorting the thermostat wires to the ground with my screw driver, entirely my bad for being sloppy but I found a 5 amp and put it in there for today. I unhooked the thermostat wires (only had 2) and hooked up a 3 foot chunk of speaker wire to hang out of the furnace instead. When I twist the wires together the furnace operates just like it should. Of course it'll stay on forever if I leave it like this but now I know the control board is apparently fine and the thermostat is the problem. This is old school tech here, just a temp sensitive spring and a contact point. I don't see how a thermostat that could be from the 70's is the problem but it is. It is just a contact point after all.

Doc first asked me about a "fan on" or "cool" option. I'm guessing I somehow have the option to have this thing hooked up to just circulate air. Maybe if I get the right thermostat I can do this I'm thinking? That would be nice for summer but it's never been an option the way it was installed.

Nice! I would not have thought the stat would be the problem.

If your board in the furnace has terminals R,Y,G,and W and of course it does then you certainly can get a stat with the same terminals, all new ones do, and hook it up.

R is your constant power to the stat, Y would be cool, W would be heat and G is fan only on. Just connect from stat to furnace exactly to the same terminal on each, stat and control board.

Turn off the power to the furnace first, don't want to blow another fuse.
__________________
Thanks.
Doc Holliday is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2012, 09:25 PM   #14
how
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Vancouver BC
Posts: 1,492
Rewards Points: 8
Default

New control board or fix it?


My vote goes to the 3 amp fuse being changed for a 5 amp or some change on the board with the removal and remounting because the thermostat circuit bypass just doesn't make any sense.
how is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2012, 09:30 PM   #15
I'm Your Huckleberry
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 5,768
Rewards Points: 28
Default

New control board or fix it?


Quote:
Originally Posted by how View Post
My vote goes to the 3 amp fuse being changed for a 5 amp or some change on the board with the removal and remounting because the thermostat circuit bypass just doesn't make any sense.

The plot thickens...

__________________
Thanks.
Doc Holliday is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Bad control board? juddskee HVAC 12 12-24-2011 09:59 AM
Changing Control Board Questions -- HSI module and AC wire connection humdinger0102 HVAC 7 11-17-2011 12:16 AM
Carrier 58 ga100-2 control board. Is it replaceable? Please help newman0112 HVAC 11 10-11-2011 07:39 PM
blower control board ferawhile HVAC 0 04-14-2011 10:57 AM
HELP? Control Board Fixed Heat...But Now A/C Won't Turn On - Homeowner KLR HVAC 35 08-15-2009 10:46 AM




Top of Page | View New Posts

Copyright © 2003-2014 Escalate Media. All Rights Reserved.