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Old 04-16-2012, 05:28 PM   #16
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Negative Pressure in Furnace & Heater Room


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Originally Posted by monch View Post
We live in Wisconsin. We signed a one year lease 3 months ago, that is why I'm trying to have him correct all the problems for our sake. He's just an arrogant person, not wanting to admit his mistake nor correct them. I'm disappointed about what is happening but if you guys believe this is a major problem, this will give me more reason to tell him to fix this immediately.
If he is not fixing it, and the structure is not zoned for multiple family living, do yourself a favor and move. It is obvious if he is skirting the law by removing the Cold Air return. Are there smoke & CO detectors installed? Does your state/county/city or village mandate having fire extinguishers or water surpression systems in multi-tenant dwellings? Does the county/city/village know that he is using a single family residence for multi-tenant renting? Are there proper egress and not shared entrances and exits to the basement area?

You can probably do yourself a huge favor and move as quick as possible. Do not pass go, do not collect $200 (yes do collect your deposit if you gave one), report him to the authorities, and if needed obtain a lawyer qualified in tenant rights.

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Old 04-16-2012, 05:47 PM   #17
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Negative Pressure in Furnace & Heater Room


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Better yet, tell him to come on here. You might want to fix your last statement though, talk about how pleasant and nice and concerned he his.
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Old 04-16-2012, 05:51 PM   #18
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Negative Pressure in Furnace & Heater Room


What kind of a person would remove the return drop.

In reality, the return grille in the door will need to be fairly large, and the under cut of the doors higher then he thinks, in order to prevent back drafting that water heater.

Where does the combustion air for the water heater come from.
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Old 04-16-2012, 05:59 PM   #19
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Negative Pressure in Furnace & Heater Room


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What kind of a person would remove the return drop.
An idiot, or someone in the middle of wanting to put in something like a Aprilaire and they run out of money in the middle of the job.
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:02 PM   #20
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Negative Pressure in Furnace & Heater Room


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What kind of a person would remove the return drop.

In reality, the return grille in the door will need to be fairly large, and the under cut of the doors higher then he thinks, in order to prevent back drafting that water heater.

Where does the combustion air for the water heater come from.
From the WH vent pipe where else....

Run the furnace, hold a smoke at the induction hood on the WH, does the smoke go up and out or back in the room?

If it come back into the room, don't run the furnace until the problem is fixed.

At a minimum the RA should be extended out of the untility room.

Mark
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:03 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by gregzoll View Post
If he is not fixing it, and the structure is not zoned for multiple family living, do yourself a favor and move. It is obvious if he is skirting the law by removing the Cold Air return. Are there smoke & CO detectors installed? Does your state/county/city or village mandate having fire extinguishers or water surpression systems in multi-tenant dwellings? Does the county/city/village know that he is using a single family residence for multi-tenant renting? Are there proper egress and not shared entrances and exits to the basement area?
We are renting the whole house but no one sleeps in the basement, except for a brief 4-night stay by my brother & his family last week. If we would rent out the basement, it would be to a relative or a close friend only.

This is not the only thing that he did wrong. I would be tied to the computer the whole week if I discuss some more of his mistakes.

Anyway, there is a CO detector on each level but I installed an extra one in the furnace room. It has not sounded yet and the reading has always been zero.
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:18 PM   #22
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Negative Pressure in Furnace & Heater Room


Oh, tell us what else is wrong. We all have plenty of time, and love this. I am sure that your local news outlets would love this. Here is a house in Sun Prairie that was destroyed because of improper repairs done http://www.wkow.com/Global/story.asp?S=13487601

Wisconsin Tenant Resource Center

Another resource http://wis-law.com/tenant.html

RIGHTS AND DUTIES OF THE LANDLORD/TENANT
Under Wisconsin law, there are many duties and obligations required of the landlord and of the tenant, even when there is no lease. For example, a landlord cannot make any misrepresentations to the tenant when they are negotiating for the premises. This is fairly understandable, however, in Wisconsin the landlord must take an additional step and inform the tenant of any conditions that would be revealed by a reasonable inspection. When a lease (oral or written) is agreed upon, an "implied warranty" is created, which means that the premises have to be in a reasonable condition throughout the period of the lease. However, if at the time that premises were originally shown, the landlord did disclose all of the poor conditions that existed, and the tenant agreed to rent anyway, then the tenant waives his/her right to object to these poor conditions, unless there are outright code violations.

Upkeep: A landlord is required to provide reasonable upkeep, provided the tenant does not do anything unreasonable to damage the property. This reasonable upkeep includes: 1. Keep in reasonable state of repair portions of the premises over which the landlord maintains control; 2. Keep in a reasonable state of repair all equipment under the landlord's control necessary to supply services which the landlord has expressly or impliedly agreed to furnish to the tenant, such as heat, water, elevator or air conditioning; 3. Make all necessary structural repairs; 4. Except for residential premises subject to a local housing code, repair or replace any plumbing, electrical wiring, machinery or equipment furnished with the premises and no longer in reasonable working condition; 5. For a residential tenancy, comply with a local housing code applicable to the premises. If there is damage to one tenants premises which is caused by other tenants in the same unit, the landlord still must make the necessary repairs. These duties are set out in Section 704.07(2) Wisconsin Statutes.

A tenant also has rights regarding the upkeep or improvement of the premises. See Section 704.05(4) Wisconsin Statutes.
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:21 PM   #23
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Negative Pressure in Furnace & Heater Room


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Originally Posted by Jackofall1 View Post
From the WH vent pipe where else....

Run the furnace, hold a smoke at the induction hood on the WH, does the smoke go up and out or back in the room?

If it come back into the room, don't run the furnace until the problem is fixed.

At a minimum the RA should be extended out of the untility room.

Mark
Interestingly enough, the smoke is being sucked through the vent pipe. Is this because we have a wind advisory (20mph winds, gusting to 45mph+), and it is sucking the air from the pipes or should it be the reverse (blowing in)? Should I try this when the winds die down?
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:26 PM   #24
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Negative Pressure in Furnace & Heater Room


Yes, high pressure from the wind passing over the house can cause that. Look up Bernoulli's principle, along with Chimney effect.
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:28 PM   #25
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Negative Pressure in Furnace & Heater Room


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Interestingly enough, the smoke is being sucked through the vent pipe. Is this because we have a wind advisory (20mph winds, gusting to 45mph+), and it is sucking the air from the pipes or should it be the reverse (blowing in)? Should I try this when the winds die down?
Heat rises, you have a good natural draft going, yes the wind does help at times. Did you try this test with the door closed to the room?

My point is that if, the vent is working correctly and it sounds like it is you would be hard pressed to get your landlord to move on this.

Given the CO sensor has never gone off, I would venture a guess that you are not drawing HW tank fumes back in to the room.

Is the install correct OH heck no, will it work sure it will.
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:35 PM   #26
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Oh, tell us what else is wrong. We all have plenty of time, and love this.
Well, I can tell you that during the initial inspection, the inspector found out there's no vent for the clothes dryer.

So while installing one, he cut one of the ducts 1 inch short. What did he do? He used DUCT tape to connect them with one inch gap instead of buying another one and overlap them properly.
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:38 PM   #27
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Was the furnace running when you checked the draft of the water heater. If n o, run the furnace and recheck the draft.
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:41 PM   #28
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Negative Pressure in Furnace & Heater Room


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Originally Posted by monch View Post
How, here is the picture of the furnace, it's a Comfortmaker. I forgot to mention that this is the basement furnace, on the left is the furnace for the first floor.




Hvac5646, while I mentioned the house is newly built, it has not passed inspection yet, at least a few items need to be rectified. Although when the initial inspection was done, the duct was still attached to the furnace.

I don't know when the final inspection will be, but I would definitely point this problem out if this had not been rectified by that time.

Thanks for all the replies!
While your at it, have 'da bum clean the PVC. It's filthy.

Just my two cents.
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:45 PM   #29
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Was the furnace running when you checked the draft of the water heater. If n o, run the furnace and recheck the draft.
I did run the fan and the door was closed. I will try again when the winds die down outside.
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Old 04-16-2012, 06:51 PM   #30
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all I can say is....... wow

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