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Leroy1985 11-10-2010 07:02 PM

Natural Gas Heater and Lines
 
Hello, I am a Newbie so excuse any ignorance I display. I have a few questions and concerns regarding natural gas lines in my home. My wife and I own a Four Square victorian home In Savannah Ga that was built in 1900. The house has no insulation (well for the most part) and has the original wood flooring. It is two stories approximatly 1400 Square foot. When we bought the house its only heat source was a vented Natural gas heater from Sears, it was from the 80's so I tore it out. We have been using about 5 Electic space heaters which only accomplishes a very high electric bill and little warmth. This year Im wanting to attempt a ventless gas heater but I cannot decide on the gas line and how to do it. Right now the current gas lines are in horrible shape; from the meter into the underneath of house is done in galvanized piping, then it goes into black iron which (goes to the hot water heater and stove) and it also splits into copper pipe which runs to the heater. Im wanting to replace all of it from the meter to the heater, which is about 20 feet. I was wanting to run CSST from the meter to the heater (as the heater is the only gas appliance) but Im hearing conflicting stories about CSST and Black Iron. The lines will not be in any walls, just under the floor. The heater I have is a ventless 30k BTU. Im gonna install a fresh air vent near by as well. Any Advice on the gas lines? Im gonna only be running the gas about three months of the year at most, then it it will be shut off at meter.
Thanks
Leroy

hvactech126 11-10-2010 07:46 PM

gas pipe
 
I'm a heating contractor, we only use black iron, no flex, no copper, deff no galvanized! I would recommend black iron, less headaches:thumbup:

kenmac 11-10-2010 08:20 PM

Don't know about your area but, here you have to be certified gas fitter to pull permit for gas lines. FIGC prohibits the use of space heaters as sole source of heat. Best to let a pro install the gas lines

beenthere 11-10-2010 08:51 PM

I think you'll find that the IFGC prohibits a ventless from being the only source of heat.

To run CSST, you'll need to check if its approved to be connected at the meter. Some require special protection be added to connect at the meter.

You'll also need to add a bonding wire to the CSST. Thats been a code requirement for 4 or 5 years now. So how far away is your electrical panel from your gas line run.

Leroy1985 11-10-2010 09:10 PM

yeah
 
Ive read about the space heaters and ventless heaters being a main source of heat, its the only option I have right now. I cannot think of a better way to supply warmth to my family without central heat and air. Which is gonna cost about 8 thousand dollars. I think that the lack of 'tightness' my house has will allow fresh air more than a new constructed house. Ive read about the CSST lines having issues from Lightning strikes and that it has to be grounded. Im confused on it because I thought gas meters coming out of the ground are grounded so wouldnt the CSST line be grounded as well? The gas line is about 12 feet away from the electrical panel.

hvac122 11-10-2010 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leroy1985 (Post 532271)
Ive read about the space heaters and ventless heaters being a main source of heat, its the only option I have right now. I cannot think of a better way to supply warmth to my family without central heat and air. Which is gonna cost about 8 thousand dollars. I think that the lack of 'tightness' my house has will allow fresh air more than a new constructed house. Ive read about the CSST lines having issues from Lightning strikes and that it has to be grounded. Im confused on it because I thought gas meters coming out of the ground are grounded so wouldnt the CSST line be grounded as well? The gas line is about 12 feet away from the electrical panel.


May keep your family warm but also sick or dead. I have seen the effects of carbon monoxide close up and wouldn't put my family in harms way because I think my house would leak enough to make up for the sick air. Nothing burns 100% so I think this is a very bad idea. There are reasons for the codes.

beenthere 11-10-2010 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leroy1985 (Post 532271)
Ive read about the space heaters and ventless heaters being a main source of heat, its the only option I have right now. I cannot think of a better way to supply warmth to my family without central heat and air. Which is gonna cost about 8 thousand dollars. I think that the lack of 'tightness' my house has will allow fresh air more than a new constructed house.

The code was written because people died because they thought their old house had enough fresh air from leaks.

Ive read about the CSST lines having issues from Lightning strikes and that it has to be grounded. Im confused on it because I thought gas meters coming out of the ground are grounded so wouldnt the CSST line be grounded as well?

Nope. CSST has blown up.

The gas line is about 12 feet away from the electrical panel.

You can do it by code. or you can risk your family.

Stick in a couple 4000 watt electric baseboard heaters.

Leroy1985 11-11-2010 05:49 AM

I was born in MD and we used nothing but baseboard heaters, I dont have enough room in the panel for it. Its difficult to heat downstairs because I got 13ft high ceilings. Any hoot, can anyone send me a link that talks about the deaths or poisoning caused by ventless heaters?

jbfan 11-11-2010 06:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leroy1985 (Post 532394)
I was born in MD and we used nothing but baseboard heaters, I dont have enough room in the panel for it. Its difficult to heat downstairs because I got 13ft high ceilings. Any hoot, can anyone send me a link that talks about the deaths or poisoning caused by ventless heaters?

I haven't been to Savannah in a few years, soo for the right payment I could install a sub panel and feed some baseboard heaters!!!!!!!!!!!:whistling2:

Base board heating would be much better than the space heaters, and much safer!

kenmac 11-11-2010 06:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leroy1985 (Post 532271)
Im confused on it because I thought gas meters coming out of the ground are grounded so wouldnt the CSST line be grounded as well? .



Most gas lines now are plastic.. I it happens to be metal gas pipe, the gas co probably has an insulated union somewhere to keep their corrosion protection (electrical current) off your gas line

yuri 11-11-2010 07:07 AM

Usually has a di-electric coupling/union where their line comes out of the ground and enters the meter.

Marty S. 11-11-2010 10:49 AM

flex gas pipe
 
One of the other techs I work with was doing a no cool call when the customer complained about a hot spot on the floor. He opened the drywall ceiling in the basement and found a 12" flame burning, floor joists were charred. Turns out that flex gas line wasn't grounded or bonded and it pin holed and arced in a lightning storm 2 week earlier. Lucky their house didn't burn down. The stuff HAS to be grounded!

yuri 11-11-2010 11:11 AM

Yeeech. :excl: It's amazing how lightning and power surges can enter a house and start a fire. Had an incident in my house with a power surge. Went thru the ground wire of the house and started smoking these electronic wall timers that I had to turn outside lights on. Scared the life out of me and lucky I wuz home. Replaced them with a industrial time clock from a refrigeration unit. Always think these things happen to someone else.

beenthere 11-11-2010 05:42 PM

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/bo...0602-wzxa.html

Red Squirrel 11-11-2010 10:08 PM

I'd save up for a proper high efficiency forced air system. Meanwhile get some electric space heaters - look at the oil filled one, they are probably the safest. If you have carpet, get a box of cheap ceramic tiles and place the heaters on them.

This may run the electrical bill through the roof, but at least you won't risk CO poisoning. You may want some fans to blow air around in the basement and have at least one big heater there, or you may risk having pipes freezing.


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