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Old 01-22-2012, 01:33 PM   #16
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Major pressurization issue


Your system should have a bypass damper. that would allow the excess air to bypass the single zone that is calling.

Not the best install that they could have done for you. poor return connection method at the furnace.

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Old 01-22-2012, 01:33 PM   #17
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Major pressurization issue


where do you live? it helps us to know because we may have local guys here who know your codes better. You may also end up with a HUGE problem with that furnace as it is NOT a 2 pipe vented system which it should be. it is taking the combustion air from the furnace room area/basement and with the strange pressures you got that may be a big problem later with it not getting enough air and tripping pressure switches etc. lots of contractors are too damn lazy and cheap to install the second pipe and take the air from outside which is what I recommend you have done. not illegal to use 1 pipe just a bad idea. sorry for the bad news.
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Old 01-22-2012, 01:46 PM   #18
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Major pressurization issue


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where do you live? it helps us to know because we may have local guys here who know your codes better. You may also end up with a HUGE problem with that furnace as it is NOT a 2 pipe vented system which it should be. it is taking the combustion air from the furnace room area/basement and with the strange pressures you got that may be a big problem later with it not getting enough air and tripping pressure switches etc. lots of contractors are too damn lazy and cheap to install the second pipe and take the air from outside which is what I recommend you have done. not illegal to use 1 pipe just a bad idea. sorry for the bad news.
I also noticed that, many manufacturers will not even honor the warranty if a unit is installed incorrectly which is one obviously is.

Also the fact that all the ductwork is flexible duct instead of most of it being rigid ducting certainly shows a lack of quality workmanship.
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Old 01-22-2012, 01:58 PM   #19
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Major pressurization issue


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where do you live? it helps us to know because we may have local guys here who know your codes better. You may also end up with a HUGE problem with that furnace as it is NOT a 2 pipe vented system which it should be. it is taking the combustion air from the furnace room area/basement and with the strange pressures you got that may be a big problem later with it not getting enough air and tripping pressure switches etc. lots of contractors are too damn lazy and cheap to install the second pipe and take the air from outside which is what I recommend you have done. not illegal to use 1 pipe just a bad idea. sorry for the bad news.
We live in the Knoxville, TN area. Thanks for the info. Much appreciated.
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Old 01-22-2012, 02:00 PM   #20
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I also noticed that, many manufacturers will not even honor the warranty if a unit is installed incorrectly which is one obviously is.

Also the fact that all the ductwork is flexible duct instead of most of it being rigid ducting certainly shows a lack of quality workmanship.
Sounds like I should really have a quality HVAC contractor out here to do an assessment of all the issues. Being new in town and not really knowing anyone makes it difficult to know who to call.

Does anyone have suggestions on how to go about finding a quality HVAC contractor to come and do an assessment?
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Old 01-22-2012, 02:04 PM   #21
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Your system should have a bypass damper. that would allow the excess air to bypass the single zone that is calling.

Not the best install that they could have done for you. poor return connection method at the furnace.
Dumb question(s). When you say the system should have a bypass damper does that mean:
  • When the basement heat is on, it should not be drawing cold air return from the first floor?
  • When the first floor heat is on, it should not be drawing cold air return from the basement?
Thanks!
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Old 01-22-2012, 02:06 PM   #22
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hang in here for at least 2 days as there are LOTS of readers, just takes a day or more B4 they get here.
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Old 01-22-2012, 02:06 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by stickner View Post
Dumb question(s). When you say the system should have a bypass damper does that mean:
  • When the basement heat is on, it should not be drawing cold air return from the first floor?
  • When the first floor heat is on, it should not be drawing cold air return from the basement?
Thanks!
In either case there should be a balanced condition meaning that the supply air matches the return air, in the zone being serviced. Hence the need for a multispeed fan set-up and a bypass damper.

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Old 01-22-2012, 02:07 PM   #24
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I also noticed that, many manufacturers will not even honor the warranty if a unit is installed incorrectly which is one obviously is.

Also the fact that all the ductwork is flexible duct instead of most of it being rigid ducting certainly shows a lack of quality workmanship.
Not being an HVAC person at all, what do you think about our system is improperly installed (enough so that the manufacturer would not honor the warranty)?

This is only the beginning of our headaches with this builder... I can see where this is headed. Why can't people just do things right the first time? So frustrating. Sorry for venting, but my wife and I are so distraught over all the issues that we are having.
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Old 01-22-2012, 02:13 PM   #25
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In either case there should be a balanced condition meaning that the supply air matches the return air, in the zone being serviced. Hence the need for a multispeed fan set-up and a bypass damper.

Mark
Here is perhaps an interesting bit of information for everyone. Right after we moved in, the further away you went from the heat registers, the bigger the reduction in air that was coming out.

There are several heat registers at the "far edges" of the house that hardly NO AIR was coming through. It was obviously much colder in those areas. We called the builder, and they sent the HVAC guy out. He turned UP the fan speed and that somewhat "fixed" the issue.

So if they turn the fan speed down, combined with having a bypass damper, we are probably going to be in the same situation where the heat registers that are far away from the furnace are hardly going to blow any air. This is probably due to horrible duct design is my assumption.
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Old 01-22-2012, 02:14 PM   #26
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Major pressurization issue


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Originally Posted by stickner View Post
Not being an HVAC person at all, what do you think about our system is improperly installed (enough so that the manufacturer would not honor the warranty)?

This is only the beginning of our headaches with this builder... I can see where this is headed. Why can't people just do things right the first time? So frustrating. Sorry for venting, but my wife and I are so distraught over all the issues that we are having.
I would not go that far and say anything voids the warranty now, BUT it does have to have proper airflow so the heat exchanger does not continually overheat and get damaged. DIFFICULT to prove that but they are going to study failed heat exchangers more closely in the future and if it looks overheated may be void. I HATE to say it but the ductwork looks awful sloppy and not the way I have ever seen it done. The return duct usually is larger square metal duct and insulated. all those kinks you have in that flex duct restrict air and maybe all the contractors do it that way in your area. just looks quick, easy and bush league to me. Sorry.
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Last edited by yuri; 01-22-2012 at 02:18 PM.
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Old 01-22-2012, 02:17 PM   #27
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Major pressurization issue


Another piece of info on this HVAC contractor.

We had a problem where the dining room vent on the first floor was blowing air LIKE crazy when the BASEMENT unit would kick on. We called and complained about this and they sent out the HVAC guy.

The HVAC guy tapped into the line that went to the dining room - and simply connected that line to the cold air return. This reduced the amount of air coming through the dining room vent but is obviously the wrong way to do it.

We complained again, and they came back out and put the dining room vent onto ONLY the first floor system.

This HVAC contractor is something else.
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Old 01-22-2012, 02:21 PM   #28
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Major pressurization issue


Quote:
Originally Posted by stickner View Post
Dumb question(s). When you say the system should have a bypass damper does that mean:
  • When the basement heat is on, it should not be drawing cold air return from the first floor?
  • When the first floor heat is on, it should not be drawing cold air return from the basement?
Thanks!
The above is correct.

Your poor air flow to the furtherest supplies is from the duct system being under sized.
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Old 01-22-2012, 02:22 PM   #29
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Major pressurization issue


you are probably going to have to hire a mechanical engineer who knows hvac duct design and get him to take pics and document everything as it may end up in court and us contractors are not paid expert witnesses and do that sort of thing. however if it barely meets the local codes and every contractor gets away with that style of work you have a bigger problem in general.
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Old 01-22-2012, 02:49 PM   #30
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Here is perhaps an interesting bit of information for everyone. Right after we moved in, the further away you went from the heat registers, the bigger the reduction in air that was coming out.

There are several heat registers at the "far edges" of the house that hardly NO AIR was coming through. It was obviously much colder in those areas. We called the builder, and they sent the HVAC guy out. He turned UP the fan speed and that somewhat "fixed" the issue.

So if they turn the fan speed down, combined with having a bypass damper, we are probably going to be in the same situation where the heat registers that are far away from the furnace are hardly going to blow any air. This is probably due to horrible duct design is my assumption.
It also sounds like there are no dampers in the branch lines to adjust flow to each room/branch.

Mark

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